1st clutch & brake bleed advise needed

[Steppin Up]

1st clutch & brake bleed advice needed

Printed out cheat sheet.
Got out mityvac hand pump. Clutch went well, nice firm lever.
Started on front brakes, put teflon tape on upper bleeder. Master cylinder went dry while I had bleeder out. : Bled both front upper bleeders in seq. Still nothing at lever!!
Now I'm getting frustrated.
So I decide to move on and tilt smc and bleed pcv. Got nice clean fluid through it.(with help from pedal)
Did front bleeder on rear caliper. Then I thought I hope I don't have to do this again, since I don't have anything at lever.
So my question is should I stop where I'm at and start over from the beginning?
Or go through with complete seq and then start on front?

 

[wengland]

Reverse bleed - use a needle-less syringe to push brake fluid up from the caliper to the master cylinder. Really the only way to do it - fast, painless and effective.
1) Drain Master Cylinder (you did that already)
2) push fluid up from bottom, taking all air up with it!
3) Drink Beer.

 

[Steppin Up]

Thanks for the reply wengland.
I got all the air bled out finally.
I must say I am pretty proficient at bleeding the brakes now.
I think next time around I might try the motion-pro one man bleeder.
Now time to start on the coolant.

 

[Igofar]

Thanks for the reply wengland.
I got all the air bled out finally.
I must say I am pretty proficient at bleeding the brakes now.
I think next time around I might try the motion-pro one man bleeder.
Now time to start on the coolant.

Toss the Mityvac, you won't ever need it again with the MP tool.
If I may offer just a couple little extra's...
When bleeding, I use pipe cleaners to soak up the brake fluid inside the bleeders when done.
This keeps it from blowing back on your paint or plastic.
Strap your brake lever (velcro strap or nylon tie) and place a weight on your foot brake pedal over night when finished.
This will allow the micro bubbles you can't see to bleed out.
Check out my thread on brake bleeding shortcuts as far as removing the tupperware...
Or not removing the tupperware.
Sounds like you did a good job. Feels good, don't it?
MP also makes a reverse bleeder tool (more expensive) for installing
new lines (dry).
Ya always have to have the right tool for the job....
Like my squeezeable ketchup bottle..that the clear tubing fits in perfectly LOL.

 

[Steppin Up]

Ya always have to have the right tool for the job...

+1 on that for sure.
Thanks for the tips.

 

[NorCal_Ed]

Toss the Mityvac, you won't ever need it again with the MP tool.
If I may offer just a couple little extra's...
When bleeding, I use pipe cleaners to soak up the brake fluid inside the bleeders when done.
This keeps it from blowing back on your paint or plastic.
Strap your brake lever (velcro strap or nylon tie) and place a weight on your foot brake pedal over night when finished.
This will allow the micro bubbles you can't see to bleed out.
Check out my thread on brake bleeding shortcuts as far as removing the tupperware...
Or not removing the tupperware.
Sounds like you did a good job. Feels good, don't it?
MP also makes a reverse bleeder tool (more expensive) for installing
new lines (dry).
Ya always have to have the right tool for the job....
Like my squeezeable ketchup bottle..that the clear tubing fits in perfectly LOL.

Igofar bled my brakes because of a soft lever/pedal. It seems that from the time the bike was new no one bled the proportioning valve located just below the fuel tank on the right side. By looseing all the bolts on the right side tupperware and inserting a wad of foam to hold the fairing away from the tank you can gain access without removing the plastic. I was astounded by how much air came out. My front brakes now require just a finger pull to stop the bike. THANKS LARRY!

 

[RCS]

I have the mityvac and the Motion Pro. Guess which one has never seen the working end of a fluid line on the ST1300.

I always use the mityvac because the Motion Pro won't work on the linked braking system. Maybe I can sell my Motion Pro to a Sports bike rider with a less sophisticated braking system.

 

[Igofar]

I have the mityvac and the Motion Pro. Guess which one has never seen the working end of a fluid line on the ST1300.

I always use the mityvac because the Motion Pro won't work on the linked braking system. Maybe I can sell my Motion Pro to a Sports bike rider with a less sophisticated braking system.

I'm not sure how to even respond to your statement....
I just recycled about 5 gal of Dot 4 Brake Fluid from the last 3 months.
All of this was through my little MP tool.
I guess I better start contacting all the folks who I've done brake bleeding jobs for and tell them that my tool didn't work after all, and that their firm levers where just in their heads
There is no reason this tool would not work on ANY bleeder or type of brake system,
with the exception of installing new, dry, lines.
In that case, I'd use the reverse bleeding syringe tool.
Not trying to bad mouth your mity vac, but I stopped using them years ago!
They cause more microscopic bubbles, and put air into the system, that your trying to bleed.
Heck, just ask NorCalEd in the prior post...He watched me use it on his entire brake system, PCV valve, and clutch.
And now for the first time, he has brakes.
Maybe you were using it incorrectly?
Perhaps you should mail it to me.

 

[Justytroll]

I have the mityvac and the Motion Pro. Guess which one has never seen the working end of a fluid line on the ST1300.

I always use the mityvac because the Motion Pro won't work on the linked braking system. Maybe I can sell my Motion Pro to a Sports bike rider with a less sophisticated braking system.

Sell it to me.

 

[Igofar]

Sell it to me.

Wadda ya doing JT? I will sooooo ban you from OCD Enterprises if you go solo

 

[Justytroll]

Wadda ya doing JT? I will sooooo ban you from OCD Enterprises if you go solo

:trolls

 

[Igofar]

:trolls

:work5:

 

[squirrel Hunter]

Larry is, THE ST Whisperer:bow1:

Mike

 

[Steppin Up]

Motion Pro won't work on the linked braking system.

Why???
I am new to a linked brake system. All this brake talk has me wondering about something. The front and rear brakes on the ST are not hydraulically linked. Right ? SMC is what activates rear brake. So when you press rear pedal and it applies front brakes, what controls the amount of force that is applied to front brakes ? PCV?

 

[RCS]

Why???
I am new to a linked brake system. All this brake talk has me wondering about something. The front and rear brakes on the ST are not hydraulically linked. Right ? SMC is what activates rear brake. So when you press rear pedal and it applies front brakes, what controls the amount of force that is applied to front brakes ? PCV?

The SMC on the front wheel will operate the rear brake when the front brake is pulled. So, when you pull the front brake only the front and the rear brake are applied. The rear brake pedal also activates the rear brake. To properly drain, fill, and bleed the linked portion of the braking system you need a vacuum bleeding system. If the system wasn't linked the Motion Pro would work fine.

I am not a mechanic but I do read and follow the Honda Service manual and have bled my brakes successfully 3x.

 

[Igofar]

The SMC on the front wheel will operate the rear brake when the front brake is pulled. So, when you pull the front brake only the front and the rear brake are applied. The rear brake pedal also activates the rear brake. To properly drain, fill, and bleed the linked portion of the braking system you need a vacuum bleeding system. If the system wasn't linked the Motion Pro would work fine.

I am not a mechanic but I do read and follow the Honda Service manual and have bled my brakes successfully 3x.

As the Cop on Wild Hogs Said....."Please for the love of God Continue!" Please explain why you THINK you would need a vacum bleeder to bleed a linked system...I gotta hear this
I believe if you go back and read your OEM Honda Service Manual, it will provide you with instructions to bleed it with a vacume (for speed and convienence) and also instructions on how to bleed it manually with the simple pull and hold the lever method. The Motion pro tool, as simple as it is, merely is a device to allow you to work without holding the lever...thats all. The linked system can be bled the old manual way by anyone. You DON'T NEED a vacume bleeder to do so.
I'll make you a deal.....If you find out I'm right....you mail me your motion pro tool for free!
If you can prove I'm wrong....I'll buy your motion pro tool from you and give it to Justytroll.
Sound fair?

 

[Igofar]

Honda ST1300A Service Manual 2003-2008....
Section 17-8 Brake Fluid Replacement / Air Bleeding
.....(When) using a commercially available air brake bleeder, follow the manufacturer's operating instructions.......
This statement does not imply that you MUST use a commercial brake bleeding tool.
The Service manual for the GL1800's provide you with both manual and commercial ways to do it.
The smaller ST1300 manual only gives you the shorter version....
Also...
Section 9-8 Clutch Bleeding...(more general bleeding info)
.....(IF) a brake bleeder is not available, use the following procedure....
Pump the lever until lever resistance is felt
Connect a bleed hose to the bleed valve and bleed the system as follows.....
Squeeze the lever, open the bleed valve 1/4 turn and then close it.....
Do not release the lever until the bleed valve has been closed.
Repeat steps 1 and 2 until air bubbles do not appear in the bleeder hose...
Etc.
I also would refer you to the HONDA COMMON SERVICE manual for more bleeding procedures.
Whether its a GL1800 or ST1300, ABS or Non ABS, Linked system or not. You can bleed ANY system the old fashion way....manually.
You don't NEED a mity vac. The shops only use them to get the job done quickly to move on to the next service job.

 

[Igofar]

The SMC on the front wheel will operate the rear brake when the front brake is pulled. So, when you pull the front brake only the front and the rear brake are applied. The rear brake pedal also activates the rear brake. To properly drain, fill, and bleed the linked portion of the braking system you need a vacuum bleeding system. If the system wasn't linked the Motion Pro would work fine.

I am not a mechanic but I do read and follow the Honda Service manual and have bled my brakes successfully 3x.

The Foot brake lever also should stop the front wheel from turning. See manual for SMC and brake testing.
It instructs you to A. Make sure the rear wheel does not turn when the Caliper is pushed forward, and B. Raise the front of the bike up and make sure
the front wheel stops turning when the rear foot brake is applied.

 

[Igofar]

I just wanted to add, for those folks that are following this thread, of the MP manual bleeding, vs. the Commercial pump bleeding, that the bikes can be bled either way. However, if you choose to use the faster method (vacume pump), be sure to strap down the levers and leave them that way for a couple hours, or better yet, overnight, to bleed the micro air bubbles out that you can't see. And also use the least amount of force you can with the pump, in an attempt to try and draw the fluid through slowly.
There are several ways to do each job as I'm sure many of you have discovered. Some easier than others. Find what works for you, so you enjoy working on your bike.
And as far as believing what is in print in the OEM service manual as Gospel.....it also directs you to use an incredibly stupid amount of torque on your oil filter ! So keep an open mind, and use a little common sense.
Ride safe ya'll.
Igofar

 

[Mellow]

I just wanted to add, for those folks that are following this thread, of the MP manual bleeding, vs. the Commercial pump bleeding, that the bikes can be bled either way. However, if you choose to use the faster method (vacume pump), be sure to strap down the levers and leave them that way for a couple hours, or better yet, overnight, to bleed the micro air bubbles out that you can't see. And also use the least amount of force you can with the pump, in an attempt to try and draw the fluid through slowly.

I've never done that and have never had a problem.

I also use as much pressure as possible on the mighty vac so air doesn't get into the system.

Not arguing the point but just saying I have never had an issue in the past nor has anyone I've bleed brakes for by not doing the above.

There are many ways to do the same job and many tools along with techniques. I think at a minimum if you follow the manual you'll be just fine and the key is to just replace at the intervals in the manual and you'll probably never have issues.