Any Lithium Ion Battery Fans?

[seitz729]

About to pull the trigger on a new battery. Seems like battery technology is changing ever so rapidly. These lithium batteries seem to have similar CCA's , storage life and longevity all in a smaller and much lighter (2lbs) package. Prices have come down on them as well. I would love to get some reviews on anyone using one in the ST1300, thanks.

 

[beemerphile]

I don't think they are cost competitive yet with AGM batteries. I have run them before and have this to offer: (1) Ignore what they call "lead-acid equivalent amp-hour rating". You should spec the battery to have the same real amp-hour battery. When you do, the high price gets higher. (2) They are easily and permanently damaged by over-discharge. You should spec the battery to have a robust battery management system (BMS) to make sure it isn't accidentally killed by discharge. When you do, the higher price gets higher still. (3) The cold weather response is still lacking. Whether that is a problem or not can depend on where you live and ride. If you spec it with real amp-hour rating instead of a lead acid equivalent rating, that will ease the cold weather issues somewhat. (4) For longest service life, you should invest in a lithium specific charger that can do cell balancing. Tack on some more money to your higher still investment.

Add it all up and it will have you looking for a good deal on a quality AGM battery that fits the square hole in the bike between the battery terminals.

 

[GregO1969]

I purchased this from amazon in 2016:
Shorai LFX Lithium Battery 19AH, 12V, EQ, ldquo,A&rdquo, 4 LFX19A4-BS12
I love the battery. It cranks faster than my old lead acid battery and doesn't ever seem to "lose" it's charge even when my ST sits for a few months. I have an 07 ST1300A . The battery is quite light and is smaller than the lead acid. It comes with foam inserts to fill the battery compartment. I would definitely recommend it. Mine is going on 4 years now with no issues.

 

[spiderman302]

I would not take the risk.
I agree with Beemerphile.....

I just put a new AGM battery in my ST1300. It is 11AH and works just fine. A 19AH battery has almost twice the stored energy and would quickly start the bike with no problem.

BMS is important for longer life but one could get away with out one. My flashlight, camera, phone, radios, all use Lithium batteries with out BMS balancing. However these devices turn themselves OFF before running the battery into the death zone. Your bike will not do that.
So the part of BMS that you need is to 'disconnect' the battery for undercharge and to prevent overcharging.

The real danger is an accidental short in your wiring that will turn the battery into a road flare / smoke bomb.
I have burned up a few lithium batteries (in a Lab) and I know it would make a real mess of your bike.
The saved weight does not make a difference on a big bike.
Again, I would not take the risk, they do not make ST1300s anymore........

 

[drtyrrel]

I tried one in my BMW. It died at a gas station before it was 3 years old and gave no warning.

 

[PFD023]

Have one....love it. No problems after 2 years. Keep a lithuim battery tender on it when not riding.

 

[Erdoc48]

I have one of the Deltran batteries in the 2000 and it’s been ~ 6 years since I bought it- runs fine and when the bike is not in use, it’s hooked to a Li+ specific Battery Tender. Would I get another? Depends on the cost...the AGM (Duracell brand) operates the 94 just fine, so. AGM is also just fine for me. I agree the weight savings is negligible on a 700 lb bike. The only other benefit is 2 pos/ 2 neg terminals on the battery, so lots of room for accessory connections (yes, all fused by the way)

 

[Gerhard]

My RT has had a 21 amp hour Shorai battery since spring 2015. I live in Ontario and ride from early in the season till late. When the temperature hovers around freezing it won’t crank the engine the first time but it will a few seconds later. You learn to turn the ignition on for 20 to 30 seconds before cranking and everything works as expected, this is is only necessary first time in the morning. I bought a Shorai charger and plug it when expecting not to ride regularly otherwise it is used just like an ordinary battery. I don’t really normally think about the battery being lithium iron.

 

[sirepair]

I have Shorai in both my ST1100 and FJ-09. No issue to report other than the amazement when I received the first one. I thought the box was empty... These are so light!

These don't like the cold. In lower temps, turn the key on letting the lights run a bit before trying to start so the battery will warm up.

 

[paulcb]

My ST11s battery is working just fine, but at over 4 years old I expect to need one soon. I only see disadvantages for the LI battery. What's the advantage, what am I missing?

 

[wjbertrand]

I'm running a Scorpion LiFePO battery that I got from Batterystuff.com in my Super Tenere for about a year and a half so far. It turns out that my Yamaha uses the exact same size battery as the ST1300. In the case of the Super Tenere, the OEM AGM battery, even when new, barely cranked the bike over. The Li really cranks vigorously by comparison. I'm pretty sure the reduced weight has taken a second off my 1/4 mile time too

 

[T_C]

The real danger is an accidental short in your wiring that will turn the battery into a road flare / smoke bomb.
I have burned up a few lithium batteries (in a Lab) and I know it would make a real mess of your bike.
The saved weight does not make a difference on a big bike.

Different chemistry between the o e you burned up in the lab and the bikes.

Dead short, BTDT. Dropped a bus bar across the terminals of a 20 am/hr battery while disassembling it. The bar turned a nice bright shade of red and orange as the battery discharged at a 200 amp rate.

Puncture a battery is a danger? Yes, on some lithium, not LiFe. Again, BTDT! Sliced one open on a tablesaw, accidentally of course. End result was the same. No danger. Only damage was to the wallet.

I like 'em. Weight is an advantage but I really like the deep cycle capability (thousands) and because they keep cranking until their last breath. Two things lead acid can not do, not even close.

First one I built was a bigger one, for the ST to do double duty as a power supply when I camp. It only came out of the bike because I wanted the cells for another purpose.

In its place is a smaller model (bought pre-assembled) and it works just fine. Slows the crank a little in colder months but started my steed just fine at -5° F.

 

[970mike]

I am using this Antigravity in all three of my bikes. The one in the ST is only the second battery in 210,000 miles and is still going strong after eight years.

 

[Uncle Phil]

The only other benefit is 2 pos/ 2 neg terminals on the battery, so lots of room for accessory connections (yes, all fused by the way)

The Motobatt AGMs have that feature also - I use them in all of my ST1100s.

 

[Larry Fine]

Add it all up and it will have you looking for a good deal on a quality AGM battery that fits the square hole in the bike between the battery terminals.

That's what I got from Walmart for $88 almost three years ago. Sat under cover through two winters, no charging or starting, and cranked right up each spring as if it had been ridden the day before.

 

[Larry Fine]

These don't like the cold. In lower temps, turn the key on letting the lights run a bit before trying to start so the battery will warm up.

Sounds like starting a Diesel.

 

[dwalby]

Sounds like starting a Diesel.

that's why you use Rotella, to complete the experience.

 

[SMSW]

I've got a Shorai and had no problems in 3 years. In retrospect, the addl cost does make this a more expensive option. And the need for a special shorai charger adds insult to injury. It cannot charge other batteries so now I have yet another piece of hardware. The older I get the more I want to simplify things. Going to go with AGM next time. Only time will tell whether these are cost effective for the long run, though it remains to be seen if we will get some real life numbers on Li battery life from a study by a disinterested third party and not just anecdotal evidence from users. Bottom line, what we are posting here is the latter and YMMV.

As far as the guys who see no advantage, they are clearly much bigger, younger and stronger. The difference in weight between the AGM and the Li battery makes a big difference when you have to pick up the bike.

 

[STRider]

... You should spec the battery to have a robust battery management system (BMS) to make sure it isn't accidentally killed by discharge. When you do, the higher price gets higher still.

So I'm not yet pulling the trigger on a LiFePO battery, but I am looking at a multiport charger, like the NOCO GENIUS2X4 and I'd like to know if it will support such a battery in the future.

They claim support for "12V lithium-ion batteries (including lithium iron phosphate). Only for batteries with Battery Management Systems (BMS)."

How does one know if you have BMS? Is this integral to the battery itself or is it build into the vehicle and the charging goes through some circuit in the vehicle?


UPDATE:
Some additional sleuthing reveals that apparently the needed BMS is built into the battery, as per this battery's product description.

"Built-in Safety System - Unique built-in Battery Management System (BMS) protects our LiFePO4 batteries from overcharge, deep discharge, overloading, overheating, short circuit, and excessive low self-discharge rate. This built-in system can ensure up to 1-year of maintenance-free storage."​

Not cheap at $158USD but also not obviously marketed for motorcycle use either.

 

[wjbertrand]

I probably would not have gone for a Lithium battery except that my Super Tenere was barely starting with the OEM YTZ12S. Leaving it sit a week or so would require hooking up the battery tender the night before. A YTZ14S will fit and is a popular upgrade, but only adds about 20 CCA (230 vs 210). The Scorpion Li replacement is rated at 387 CCA. More money for sure, but I'm happier with the vigorous cranking it provides, even if left for 5-6 weeks when we were out of the country.

The ST1300 always started very quickly and easily for me, even with an undersized 210 CCA battery fitted.