Are BMW's Overrated ?

[Bravo616]

I stopped by a local BMW dealer to look at the K1300GT. The bike really LOOKS and rides great IMHO. However, before plunking down more than 23K on a bike, several things come to mind:

1. Dealer network very, very small compared to Honda. I don't want to be stuck in the middle of nowhere.
2. Warranty sucks...if BMW's are so great, why doesn't the company stand behind them? BTW, an extended warranty is NOT offered by the factory, only the dealer.
3. Many owner report problems with KT final drive failures and electrical problems. Why did K1200GT last only 2 model years?
4. Parts and service very expensive compared to my ST1300.
5. Apparently BMW forces these bikes down the dealers throat, that's why the network stinks.


Is this bike really that good?
I can afford one and would be driving a KT1300 right now if it weren't for these issues.

Owners feel free to chime in.

 

[Mellow]

I stopped by a local BMW dealer to look at the K1300GT. The bike really LOOKS and rides great IMHO. However, before plunking down more than 23K on a bike, several things come to mind:

1. Dealer network very, very small compared to Honda. I don't want to be stuck in the middle of nowhere.
You could say the big Honda network doesn't mean much when they rarely see an ST.

2. Warranty sucks...if BMW's are so great, why doesn't the company stand behind them? BTW, an extended warranty is NOT offered by the factory, only the dealer.
I think the warranty is pretty good, a friend of mine with a GS has gotten a lot out of his.

3. Many owner report problems with KT final drive failures and electrical problems. Why did K1200GT last only 2 model years?
Many? Not too sure about that.. with the internet, one FD failure can take a life of it's own. There are some but I did hear that they have addressed this somewhat.

4. Parts and service very expensive compared to my ST1300.
You're probably dead on with that one.

5. Apparently BMW forces these bikes down the dealers throat, that's why the network stinks.
I have no idea about this so can't comment much.

Is this bike really that good?
I can afford one and would be driving a KT1300 right now if it weren't for these issues.

Owners feel free to chime in.

There are lots of BMW riders out there that love their bikes.. so to them, it is that good.. most of them would not want to ride an ST prone to heat and coolant leaks as well as the dreaded wobble.

Just throwing a different spin on things.

 

[Kevin_56]

Do not forget the Thermostat. It is the only thing that has failed on mine at nearly 49,000 miles. But many have had them fail.

Kevin

 

[BamaRider]

Well considering Honda is prolly getting out the Sport Touring segment that is known as the ST 1300 and going to a chain drive, smaller VFR based 1200, I'd say the the 1300 GT is lookin pretty good.

It is a very functional, super fast machine, with ALL the touring amenties. Looks are a personal thing, but I like it. A nice pretty red one at the local dealer.

Dealer network does suck.

Parts and getting it worked on is high, but so is anything else.

Reliable as the Honda? Prolly not, but as far as function I can't name one thing the ST 1300 does better. I mean the K bike even has cruise control and self cancel turn signals LOL.

Now is it 6 thousand dollars better? Noway. But if the ST is dropped by Honda, doesn't matter, because Honda left the court.

The K bike is on my short list for my next upgrade, providing I don't have a Honda option. If they go to a VFR ST, I'll take a look, but chain drive is a deal breaker for me. (unless I have some bad stats and it does have shaft)

I look at like this, the FJ is too sport oriented for my tastes, the C14 is overkill (behmonth) the RT is right there, but a boxer twin (besides I have one of those) so the last bike standing is the K 1300.

 

[sherob]

Take a look at it again, Guy... it's a shafty

Overkill... the K1300GT beats the C14... roll on's... dead stop 1/4 miles But it's almost twice as much

 

[Mellow]

I'm good for a while... but if it were to come down to the current offerings... I'd have to consider the FJR or Connie as a replacement for my ST.

 

[Chris Parker]

I have ridden both the ST1300 (owned one), the K1200GT and the K1300GT, and the K is just in another league. I like it better than any bike I have test ridden. It is seductive and fast, has all the option I want and you can buy one for less than the full sticker if you buy at the right time. Yes, it is still more expensive than the ST or even my RT, but I think it is worth it, especially the new K1300 version.

The last point about BMW Motorrad shoving these new bikes down the dealers throats... I find that amusing. They sell everyone they get (Have you every seen a leftover RT or GT from the year before on the floor of a BMW dealer?) and BMW's sales rate in the last several years has gone UP. They must be doing something right. Plus, aside from the K1200LT, which is due for a refresh soon, all their other bikes have been refreshed and new models coming out. Which is something you can't say for Honda these days. The RT has had two variations in the time the ST1300 has been on the market here in the U.S., the GT Three, the GS two, so on and so... at least BMW is trying to push new models.

I just wish that Honda and others would aggressively push the sport touring/dual sport market as much as they add to new cruisers and their variants. Then I would be happy.

I will say I am excited to see what the new VFR1200T or whatever this ST1300 replacement thingie is going to be.

 

[Kempo-STer]

Take a look at it again, Guy... it's a shafty

Overkill... the K1300GT beats the C14... roll on's... dead stop 1/4 miles But it's almost twice as much

Frankly by defination...who gives a rays ash about rolls ons...its about fillin the mission of sport tourin...

 

[sherob]

Frankly by defination...who gives a rays ash about rolls ons...its about fillin the mission of sport tourin...

I know... the C14 does it for me... albiet I stop a bit sooner than the guys I ride with... LOL!!!

 

[saaz]

The VFR1200 seems like it will be a platform for a range of bikes, just like the BMW 4s. I must say that the BMW1300GT ticks more boxes for me than pretty well any other bike, as they have factory options not available elsewhere. Worth the price...well, if I was going to buy new may as well take the full shock!

 

[sherob]

I love the K13s... in white :bow1: That bike just says... well, it says alot of things to me :

 

[Kempo-STer]

I have ridden both the ST1300 (owned one), the K1200GT and the K1300GT, and the K is just in another league. I like it better than any bike I have test ridden. It is seductive and fast, has all the option I want and you can buy one for less than the full sticker if you buy at the right time. Yes, it is still more expensive than the ST or even my RT, but I think it is worth it, especially the new K1300 version.

The last point about BMW Motorrad shoving these new bikes down the dealers throats... I find that amusing. They sell everyone they get (Have you every seen a leftover RT or GT from the year before on the floor of a BMW dealer?) and BMW's sales rate in the last several years has gone UP. They must be doing something right. Plus, aside from the K1200LT, which is due for a refresh soon, all their other bikes have been refreshed and new models coming out. Which is something you can't say for Honda these days. The RT has had two variations in the time the ST1300 has been on the market here in the U.S., the GT Three, the GS two, so on and so... at least BMW is trying to push new models.

I just wish that Honda and others would aggressively push the sport touring/dual sport market as much as they add to new cruisers and their variants. Then I would be happy.

I will say I am excited to see what the new VFR1200T or whatever this ST1300 replacement thingie is going to be.

Yeah but Chris,
You made the switch when all you friends were in the roundel because if I remember correctly..so you can "belong"......how very Harley of you!:::

 

[hojo in sc]

Yeah but Chris,
You made the switch when all you friends were in the roundel because if I remember correctly..so you can "belong"......how very Harley of you!:::

I don't believe that too be a true statement, the facts are missing.

And I'd like to know why Honda has dropped the bag for marketing Dual Sport bikes in the US.

 

[Kempo-STer]

I don't believe that too be a true statement,

only CHRIS can answer that:

 

[Bones]

Well considering Honda is prolly getting out the Sport Touring segment that is known as the ST 1300 and going to a chain drive, smaller VFR based 1200, I'd say the the 1300 GT is lookin pretty good.

Everything I've seen about the VFR1200 models shows shaft drive for all of them.

(Have you every seen a leftover RT or GT from the year before on the floor of a BMW dealer?)

Yes, at AJ's Cycle Sales in Gill, MA and at Gengras BMW in East Hartford, CT. Both had 2007 RT's on the floor in late spring 2008. I haven't been back to either since.

"Overrated" depends on one's rating system. I found it fascinating, on an episode of Top Gear, where Jeremy Clarkson was left speechless when a Porsche 911 bested a BMW M6 V10 on an Isle of Man circuit by a huge margin (several seconds). The BMW had more power, more gadgets, and cost more, but it couldn't keep up with the 911 which James May and Richard Hammond liked so much they each bought one of their own. (Must be nice to have a Top Gear presenter's income.) The supposedly superior BMW was no faster around the circuit than the Aston Martin, which has substantially less power than the BMW and which all three presenters expected to finish far behind the Bimmer and the Porsche.

Drive what you like. Ride what you like. What matters is your own rating scale.

 

[Chris Parker]

Well, there is some truth to that... for the past 10 years I have hung out with a mainly BMW crowd and when I got the ST, I kinda did the foolish self-imposed- I-ride-with-the-Honda-only crowd (problem was I didn't know too many ST owners... I was the president of the Upstate BMW Motorcycle Club in 2004, so I knew the BMW riders mostly). Should have just showed them what the ST could do : )

But Howard is right, the facts are missing to most here as I didn't really want to pee on the ST crowd... just suffice it to say... I had problems (mechanical) with the ST that the dealer COULD NOT fix. In my three BMWs, I haven't had that, so I went back to the fold so to speak. I depend on my bike as it is my only means of transportation... I ride it day in and day out... It needs to fire up and work.

I think I just got a lemon. Just like those who get BMWs and have whatever has happen to them. The majority of BMW bikes are out there on the road with NO catastrophic problem at all... the negativity is magnified through the internet and those that have problems shout the loudest.

If you think about it, most manufacturers (heck, all of them really, including Harley, I begrudgingly admit) have made great strides in quality and reliability. I wasn't riding during the days of the new Japanese bikes of the late 60s and early 70s that did in the Triumphs/BSAs/Rest, which the selling point of those were the reliability of said bikes, but all manufacturers have had to improve their game to survive, including BMW... to the point that even the head of BMW Motorrad confessed a need to improve it lately with increased production rates. Realizing that there is a problem goes a long way towards fixing said problem.

 

[Chris Parker]

Yes, at AJ's Cycle Sales in Gill, MA and at Gengras BMW in East Hartford, CT. Both had 2007 RT's on the floor in late spring 2008. I haven't been back to either since.

Bones,

I will admit that can happen actually... I guess I should have clarified it better with a better explanation of the timeline... I bought mine in February 07 which is an 06 model, but the new 07s where just trickling in. I got a heck of deal on a bike that wasn't much different that 07s, except that I got the servo assisted brakes (which I love) and the 07s went back to conventional brakes.

What I am really referring to is the stories of people here buying a NEW ST from several model years ago... the bike is in the warehouse somewhere, never titled. Which amazes me... probably those bikes are the Non-ABS models as well.

Also, my dealer Touring Sport BMW in Greenville keeps the bikes moving... I have honestly never seen a bike sit more than a year... they are just gone.

 

[bdalameda]

Back in the 70's and 80's I was a real brand loyal rider. In my later years I had worked on so many different brands and models and while I restored some vintage bikes I really learned to appreciate the differences in different makes and models. I am not brand loyal anymore as every different make and model has strong and weak points and I enjoy the variety. There is no perfect motorcycle and what appeals to one may not appeal to another. I really like to look at different designs and try and visualize what went on in the engineering process that developed these different machines, how one make or model was designed based on someone interpretation of what a person would want in a motorcycle. For me this is fascinating and the variety of ideas keeps me interested.

Dan

 

[Charlie]

Different bikes for different needs.

 

[Bones]

Chris, just for fun I looked at AJ's current inventory. The new Beemers they have listed as in inventory are 2009 models. They sell Moto Guzzi as well and have new 2006 and 2007 Guzzis for sale...in fact nothing newer than 2007.

Gengras just lists every bike in the BMW lineup under their "current inventory" instead what they actually have on the floor or in the crate. I found that approach typical when I was searching for a Versys last year.

Honda did not change the ST1100 or ST1300 much year to year, except for color, and typically offered one color per year. I expect that might contribute to finding a new-in-crate bike a couple years old.