moddy
the mod
I have researched this on the web to the point I need to come here to see what some of you have tried and done. Much appreciated. I will be getting into a non runner and want to hear about what some of you have done.
Have any of you used an auto battery to have more capacity than a motorcycle batter
- Thread starter moddy
- Start date
Re: Have any of you used an auto battery to have more capacity than a motorcycle batt
No auto battery......
There was a fellow that was putting together some Lithium_Ion cells for his RocketIII on R3owners.com but I bought the ST and left the site before he tested it.....
I would be fearfull of killing alternator rectifiers though....car battery stores ALOT more energy.....
IMHO....YMMV
No auto battery......
There was a fellow that was putting together some Lithium_Ion cells for his RocketIII on R3owners.com but I bought the ST and left the site before he tested it.....
I would be fearfull of killing alternator rectifiers though....car battery stores ALOT more energy.....
IMHO....YMMV
OP
OP
moddy
the mod
Re: Have any of you used an auto battery to have more capacity than a motorcycle batt
The way I understand it is an auto battery has a lot more capacity and the voltage is the same. The problem I can see arising is if the starter is cranking and requires more juice than a motorcycle battery could provide, the auto battery will push more with the amps, hence the problem, electrical destruction. Someone may still have done it anyway, and I'm willing to try it, if there is someone who had a case of necessity and tried it to get started.
The way I understand it is an auto battery has a lot more capacity and the voltage is the same. The problem I can see arising is if the starter is cranking and requires more juice than a motorcycle battery could provide, the auto battery will push more with the amps, hence the problem, electrical destruction. Someone may still have done it anyway, and I'm willing to try it, if there is someone who had a case of necessity and tried it to get started.
Ross Smith
Ross
Re: Have any of you used an auto battery to have more capacity than a motorcycle batt
I recommend you consider switching to a Shorai.
I've got a full digital stereo system on my bike that can draw up to 4 amps at high volume off the battery and steadily drains it at 65ma when it's off. Also a cruise control that adds a few ma when idle and of course the clock with its steady 4ma drain. There are also two PTO's for accessories like cell phone chargers and a cigarette lighter.
I've moved over to the Shorai, high endurance and it's a good compromise. The standard battery for the St is 12 amp / hour. The Shorai high endurance is 18 amp / hour. CCA for the Shorai is 315 amps, quite a bit more than the standard lead / acid. Fitting the small format battery into the bike's existing battery holder took me 30 minutes, approximately.
Your biggest battery problems in the ST are really lack of space and heat stress, less so capacity. The Shorai will solve both of those for you and give you enormous cranking amperage. Capacity is only a modest 6 amp / hour increase. Depends on what you really want to do.
The Shorai costs more but if predictions of its life span being 4 times a lead acid's are true then it's going to be good value. My original Yuasa cost $124.00 with taxes. The Shorai; $186.00. It will not adversely affect your bike's charging system and will save you about 7 pounds of weight.
Ross
I recommend you consider switching to a Shorai.
I've got a full digital stereo system on my bike that can draw up to 4 amps at high volume off the battery and steadily drains it at 65ma when it's off. Also a cruise control that adds a few ma when idle and of course the clock with its steady 4ma drain. There are also two PTO's for accessories like cell phone chargers and a cigarette lighter.
I've moved over to the Shorai, high endurance and it's a good compromise. The standard battery for the St is 12 amp / hour. The Shorai high endurance is 18 amp / hour. CCA for the Shorai is 315 amps, quite a bit more than the standard lead / acid. Fitting the small format battery into the bike's existing battery holder took me 30 minutes, approximately.
Your biggest battery problems in the ST are really lack of space and heat stress, less so capacity. The Shorai will solve both of those for you and give you enormous cranking amperage. Capacity is only a modest 6 amp / hour increase. Depends on what you really want to do.
The Shorai costs more but if predictions of its life span being 4 times a lead acid's are true then it's going to be good value. My original Yuasa cost $124.00 with taxes. The Shorai; $186.00. It will not adversely affect your bike's charging system and will save you about 7 pounds of weight.
Ross
OP
OP
moddy
the mod
Re: Have any of you used an auto battery to have more capacity than a motorcycle batt
I am sorry, I didn't explain it properly. I am connecting an auto battery by way of jumper cable to have more capacity for getting it started than a smaller amp hour motorcycle battery.
I am sorry, I didn't explain it properly. I am connecting an auto battery by way of jumper cable to have more capacity for getting it started than a smaller amp hour motorcycle battery.
Tidrick
Keith B. Tidrick
Re: Have any of you used an auto battery to have more capacity than a motorcycle batt
I seem to recall a picture of an auto battery strapped to the passenger seat of an ST in order to aid a dieing alternator get home...??? Emergency use only, but sounds like maybe your situation warrents stronger measures?
I seem to recall a picture of an auto battery strapped to the passenger seat of an ST in order to aid a dieing alternator get home...??? Emergency use only, but sounds like maybe your situation warrents stronger measures?
wjbertrand
Ventura Highway
Re: Have any of you used an auto battery to have more capacity than a motorcycle batt
Jumping from a car battery is fine. Just make sure that if the battery is still in the car that the car is switched off.
Jumping from a car battery is fine. Just make sure that if the battery is still in the car that the car is switched off.
- Joined
- Feb 5, 2005
- Messages
- 8,537
- Age
- 77
- Location
- Kingman, Arizona
- Bike
- 2000 ST1100 ABS TCS
- STOC #
- 004
Re: Have any of you used an auto battery to have more capacity than a motorcycle batt
On a side note, the late model "40 amp" alternator is actually capable of more and could float a larger battery, if there was room to install one. A guy could install a second battery in a side bag, use RV type switching so you could have a power supply at camp, etc, without running down the main bike battery. String of LED party lights, stereo, etc. Just thinking out loud.
Jeff has it right. No problem jumping off a car battery, I've done it dozens of times. The largest 12 V battery will only supply as much juice as the appliance (in this case yur starter) needs. Big batteries just provide longer function.
On a side note, the late model "40 amp" alternator is actually capable of more and could float a larger battery, if there was room to install one. A guy could install a second battery in a side bag, use RV type switching so you could have a power supply at camp, etc, without running down the main bike battery. String of LED party lights, stereo, etc. Just thinking out loud.
Re: Have any of you used an auto battery to have more capacity than a motorcycle batt
I'll kill two birds here...
Using a car battery to start the bike is fine. I've not only jumped bikes from cars, but also a couple cars from bikes. Jumping a car from a bike takes more caution, to make sure the bike battery isn't drawn down too far.
For anyone reading this who may be curious about using a car battery on a bike, there is no problem with that either, although there is no real benefit. The way a vehicle's electrical system works is that the alternator is used to power all electrical devices that are constant draws- ignition system, lights, etc. The battery is only for the quick, but high draw loads- mainly the starter. By putting in a larger battery, the main benefit will be longer crank times before the battery goes dead, and the starter will run faster and cooler with more amps. But a larger battery won't cure the problem most of us face- too small of an alternator to keep up with high current use, such as having accessory lights, heated gear, etc. You will still overpower the alternator, it will just take longer for the battery to die once you do.
As for possibly damaging any electrical components- Not going to happen. Electrical loads (such as the starter) require a certain amount of power. Changing the size of the battery doesn't change the load- the starter still needs, and will use, the same amount of current. No matter what size the battery is, a 50 amp device will still only draw 50 amps. Unless you change the voltage (such as going to 24 volts), the battery doesn't change the amount of current going through the wires or how much the devices use. Think of it like drinking from a straw on a hot day. Whether you are drinking from an 8oz cup, or a 2 gallon jug, you are still drawing the same amount through the straw. The only difference is, with the 2 gallon jug, you can drink longer before it empties.
So if you are ever stranded with a dead battery, by all means, accept the help of a cage driving motorist to jump start your bike.
Jim- ASE Master Technician, with a perfect score on the Electronics test.
Edit: Looks like George beat me to it, while I was typing my long winded post...
I'll kill two birds here...
Using a car battery to start the bike is fine. I've not only jumped bikes from cars, but also a couple cars from bikes. Jumping a car from a bike takes more caution, to make sure the bike battery isn't drawn down too far.
For anyone reading this who may be curious about using a car battery on a bike, there is no problem with that either, although there is no real benefit. The way a vehicle's electrical system works is that the alternator is used to power all electrical devices that are constant draws- ignition system, lights, etc. The battery is only for the quick, but high draw loads- mainly the starter. By putting in a larger battery, the main benefit will be longer crank times before the battery goes dead, and the starter will run faster and cooler with more amps. But a larger battery won't cure the problem most of us face- too small of an alternator to keep up with high current use, such as having accessory lights, heated gear, etc. You will still overpower the alternator, it will just take longer for the battery to die once you do.
As for possibly damaging any electrical components- Not going to happen. Electrical loads (such as the starter) require a certain amount of power. Changing the size of the battery doesn't change the load- the starter still needs, and will use, the same amount of current. No matter what size the battery is, a 50 amp device will still only draw 50 amps. Unless you change the voltage (such as going to 24 volts), the battery doesn't change the amount of current going through the wires or how much the devices use. Think of it like drinking from a straw on a hot day. Whether you are drinking from an 8oz cup, or a 2 gallon jug, you are still drawing the same amount through the straw. The only difference is, with the 2 gallon jug, you can drink longer before it empties.
As what I explained above describes, the battery doesn't "push" power...the starter draws it. Whether its hooked up to a motorcycle battery or a car battery, the starter doesn't know the difference...except that a car battery might keep the voltage where it belongs longer than a motorcycle battery, which will actually help the starter. You are better off trying to start the bike hooked to a car battery than you are to try to start the bike with a half dead battery. THAT is what will damage a starter.
So if you are ever stranded with a dead battery, by all means, accept the help of a cage driving motorist to jump start your bike.
Jim- ASE Master Technician, with a perfect score on the Electronics test.
Edit: Looks like George beat me to it, while I was typing my long winded post...
- Joined
- Feb 5, 2005
- Messages
- 8,537
- Age
- 77
- Location
- Kingman, Arizona
- Bike
- 2000 ST1100 ABS TCS
- STOC #
- 004
Re: Have any of you used an auto battery to have more capacity than a motorcycle batt
I like the straw analogy, Jim.
You alluded to it, but... A larger battery might let your starter draw more amps as the bike battery might be marginally small. I know when I jump from a car battery, the starter spins faster and the bike usually starts right up. I think our stock 14 amper is marginal. The starter draws so many amps, a marginal battery barely has enuff left to spark the plugs. Not true with a car battery hooked up.
I like the straw analogy, Jim.
You alluded to it, but... A larger battery might let your starter draw more amps as the bike battery might be marginally small. I know when I jump from a car battery, the starter spins faster and the bike usually starts right up. I think our stock 14 amper is marginal. The starter draws so many amps, a marginal battery barely has enuff left to spark the plugs. Not true with a car battery hooked up.
Re: Have any of you used an auto battery to have more capacity than a motorcycle batt
What NHkerosene said, NO problem, jumping and no benefit to using one as a replacement.
Also a former Charter ASE master tech, (back in the 70's) that got 100 on the electrical component.
What NHkerosene said, NO problem, jumping and no benefit to using one as a replacement.
Also a former Charter ASE master tech, (back in the 70's) that got 100 on the electrical component.
OP
OP
moddy
the mod
Re: Have any of you used an auto battery to have more capacity than a motorcycle batt
Can I just say I like all of the posts. I don't have an electrical education but had a volt meter in hand to help install car stereo's, see if there was electricity in a wall socket instead of using a butter knife. I appreciate all of your input. I thought since the batteries were the same voltage different capacity the system would work as it should, just a longer attempt at starting intervals than a 12 or 14amp hour battery could do. Thanks
Can I just say I like all of the posts. I don't have an electrical education but had a volt meter in hand to help install car stereo's, see if there was electricity in a wall socket instead of using a butter knife. I appreciate all of your input. I thought since the batteries were the same voltage different capacity the system would work as it should, just a longer attempt at starting intervals than a 12 or 14amp hour battery could do. Thanks
Keep in mind the battery can't be completely dead to push start a 1300. I've found as long as there is enough power to turn on the instrument lights, it usually starts; but if there are no lights, forget it.
I don't know how picky 1100s are. Without fuel injection, they should need less power to start.
Jim
I don't know how picky 1100s are. Without fuel injection, they should need less power to start.
Jim
v8-7
Site Supporter
Re: Have any of you used an auto battery to have more capacity than a motorcycle batt
I'm not an ASE guy, but I did sleep at a Holiday Inn once .....
One good reason for a larger battery would be for when the lights, or heated gear are left on for just a few minutes,
like at a gas station or a quick lunch stop.
I bet there are a lot of us that carry jumper cables .
Has anyone tried to fit in something like an Odyssey pc680?
The Odyssey p680 battery has a 16 amp/h and I've seen them for ~ $115 delivered , with a 2 year warranty .
It's only marginally larger than a stock battery and might fit .
Stock
Length 6
Width 3 7/16
Height 4 3/8
Weight 8.4
PC680
Length: 7.15"
Width: 3.00"
Height: 6.65"
Shipping Weight: 16.00 Pounds
I'm not an ASE guy, but I did sleep at a Holiday Inn once .....
One good reason for a larger battery would be for when the lights, or heated gear are left on for just a few minutes,
like at a gas station or a quick lunch stop.
I bet there are a lot of us that carry jumper cables .
Has anyone tried to fit in something like an Odyssey pc680?
The Odyssey p680 battery has a 16 amp/h and I've seen them for ~ $115 delivered , with a 2 year warranty .
It's only marginally larger than a stock battery and might fit .
Stock
Length 6
Width 3 7/16
Height 4 3/8
Weight 8.4
PC680
Length: 7.15"
Width: 3.00"
Height: 6.65"
Shipping Weight: 16.00 Pounds
OP
OP
moddy
the mod
Re: Have any of you used an auto battery to have more capacity than a motorcycle batt
Have you used an automotive battery that isn't connected to a vehicle to start a motorcycle that doesn't have a battery?
Have you used an automotive battery that isn't connected to a vehicle to start a motorcycle that doesn't have a battery?
Blrfl
Natural Rider Enhancement
Re: Have any of you used an auto battery to have more capacity than a motorcycle batt
--Mark
No reason you couldn't, but the battery is actually a pretty important part of the whole electrical system, so you wouldn't want to run without one.
--Mark
Re: Have any of you used an auto battery to have more capacity than a motorcycle batt
Some of the LEO’s have made the modification for the Odyssey to fit. There are some old posts on how to do this. You have to cut out the stock battery box and make some brackets to hold the Odyssey battery in the larger space. I was going to try it, but added the 08 side covers on my 04 and need the tabs that hook on the battery box to hold the side covers on.
I wish Odyssey would make a battery that fit the ST. I have one on my wife’s Intruder 800. The battery is 6 years old; she only puts on 500-600 miles a year. It has never been on tender, and still starts the bike like I just put it in.
Do a search on the Odyssey battery. You should be able to find the old posts if you dig a little.
Some of the LEO’s have made the modification for the Odyssey to fit. There are some old posts on how to do this. You have to cut out the stock battery box and make some brackets to hold the Odyssey battery in the larger space. I was going to try it, but added the 08 side covers on my 04 and need the tabs that hook on the battery box to hold the side covers on.
I wish Odyssey would make a battery that fit the ST. I have one on my wife’s Intruder 800. The battery is 6 years old; she only puts on 500-600 miles a year. It has never been on tender, and still starts the bike like I just put it in.
Do a search on the Odyssey battery. You should be able to find the old posts if you dig a little.
OP
OP
moddy
the mod
Re: Have any of you used an auto battery to have more capacity than a motorcycle batt
Ok. This means I will be using an automotive battery to aid in a non runner and you get to hear about what happens.
Ok. This means I will be using an automotive battery to aid in a non runner and you get to hear about what happens.
- Joined
- Nov 20, 2005
- Messages
- 9,519
- Location
- Cedar City, Utah
- Bike
- 12/04 ST 1300s
- 2024 Miles
- 000420
- STOC #
- 5901
Re: Have any of you used an auto battery to have more capacity than a motorcycle batt
of moving my fuseblock to fill the void and rewire everything from there. I'll know better once I have the battery.
I plan to go to this battery when my current one is ready to die on me. And to fill the extra space, I'm thinking
of moving my fuseblock to fill the void and rewire everything from there. I'll know better once I have the battery.