Helmet cam v. bike mounted cam

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So I got all impetuous last night, thanks ADHD, and bought a helmet cam. No real research, no in depth comparison of qualities/functions and so on. Also, it's brand new and just being released, i.e., untested, no reviews to speak of, could be a complete disaster etc.

While it will be cool to watch some of my rides for pleasure or edification, i.e. what the heck were you thinking when you did that, it was as much for protection/liability in case of an accident as anything.

But it got me thinking, after the fact of course, whether it's better to have the camera on the helmet or the bike? I can see benefits flowing both ways and after an thorough and exhaustive google search of nearly 15 seconds, was unable to unearth many articles or discussions online on the topic so thought I would throw out the question here to see what people's thoughts and experiences were?
 

Andrew Shadow

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I don't know enough about either to offer an opinion of any value.
Being a lawyer who seems to handle a lot of road accident cases, you know more about the below than I do, but I thought that I would mention it for your consideration.

The below is a picture from the website that you linked to. I have read several times that in many jurisdictions (seems to be more of a European thing) anything such as this camera attached to a motorcycle helmet is illegal. The concern is the possibility of the protruding object catching on something solid in a get-off and causing serious neck injury due to whiplash. Whether that poses any issues with insurance coverage or not is something that you are better placed to know than I.

1654441988095.png
 

Willsmotorcycle

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Having struggled for years with the same questions, 512 GB for $550 or 256 GB for $200 or a GoPro, or, or, or. I too am curious of the feed back.
 
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That camera seems pretty good. INNOVV's stuff is generally of good quality, I think. The claimed battery seems amazing. Also the fact that you can plug it in an still use it, a feature missing on my Ghost X, is awesome. The only feature I'd like that is missing, I think, is GPS.

You should post the first review. I'd be interested in reading it.
 

Obo

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I see the advantage to having a permanent bike mounted system (front and rear cameras) like @SupraSabre has. For me the downside to that would be ease of downloading the footage.

As for me I have a helmet mounted camera (on the top of my helmet) and another rigid mounted for the rear view of the bike. As for capturing audio it's whatever the mic picks up. I don't try and vlog with them.

Some cameras have built in GPS, wifi and wireless remotes. Others are just "on / off" with a simple slider.

1654444425369.png1654444447466.png1654444461415.png

I can't speak to the legality of helmet mounts, but it does seem to get me noticed more. Perhaps it's more due to the fact it's mounted on top of my helmet, and not to the side or the chin that I've seen others do. I see lots of folks staring and often get questions "what is that?" and "is that a camera?"

I've also had rigid bike mounted cameras facing forward to capture video.

What I find with the helmet mounted is the image stabilization on my cameras isn't very good. Thus the footage can be shaky if I move my head around a lot. The bike mounted doesn't seem to do that as much, regardless of the 3 camera brands (including my helmet cam) I've used for that purpose.

More pros and cons: pro- helmet cam is easy to turn on and off as you desire con - can't really hard wire in aux power.
bike mounted - pro - can hard wire power like @Jim C-G does for maximum run time based on card size. con - harder to turn on off (unless you have remote or don't mind it running until card is full)

One almost needs to figure out what you want from your camera before you buy one. Optionally you can just buy one and go with the flow (as you seem fond to do.).

If/when I buy another camera (I have 4 action cams currently) I'll likely look at a 360* model, possibly helmet mounted again.

@Weaselinsuit let me know if you want to see footage from any of them and if it's not on my YT page as public I'll send you a private link.
 

ST1100Y

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... whether it's better to have the camera on the helmet or the bike?...
Methinks you'll be risking a stiff neck... trying to get steady, nice footage... fumbling for the controls might as well be an issue (unless it has a WiFi remote via smartphone)
When on the bike it'll be lower (view-field obstructed by guard rails and jersey barriers) plus the cam leans with the bike, you might tinker with several, sturdy quick-release attachment locations...
Wind-noise is a big issue, I'd suggest an external (stereo) mike with a decent dead cat...

(occasionally I run a Sony FDR-X3000R 4K Action Cam...)
 
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I went with the INNOVV K2 because it is mounted on the bike and uses a DVR. I looked at several different cameras but most of them require removing the storage device clearing and clearing the data. With the K2 it automatically overwrites old footage. I also have the option of selecting clip length. The K2 also corrects for vibration and has a large field of view. I tend to be a bit of a hooligan so I don't share my footage but I will have it if I ever get hit.
@SupraSabre also gave it a good review which helped with the decision.
 
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I appreciate all the feedback.

Andrew - I've read about that issue. I wonder if there is a baseline attachment strength required prior to an injury being caused, i.e., would the camera simply shear off on impact if it caught on something or is the attachment strong enough to provide a pivot point for injury to occur. I'll let you know what it's like when I get the camera. With respect to the insurance issue, if they are illegal then certainly using one would be off side on insurance but whether that is enough to void coverage is another issue. I don't think so, though it could possibly be raised as a contributing negligence factor by the other driver if you were to sue for injuries.

Obo - Your point about figuring out what you want before you buy is valid. I typically I obsess and review/research things a lot before purchasing but every now and again, the ADHD takes hold and an impulse buy is made. Works out sometimes and others....well, they call it buyers regret for a reason....This camera appears to have the ability to use either a battery or be plugged into an usb power source so I think you can have it continually powered though there is likely a dangling cord from the unit to the powersource. I have used a powerbank in my top jacket pocket to power my Cardo unit on the side of my helmet when on long rides and it became unnoticeable after a while though it was a very short cord. Might be different if you have a longer one running to a usb outlet say between the handlebars or near the ignition. I'd be very interested in seeing your footage.

Nexus - Will definitely post a review.

ST1000Y - I'll report back re controls and ease of use. I know that using the Cardo controls with gloves on can be challenging at times. Even using smartphone is difficult and it's in a relatively stable position right in front of me.

CJames - Funny, I was watching a listing on Ebay for a K2

I expect that I will keep the mike off when using it, not looking to vlog or to share/record my stray thoughts. Will be interested to see what the weight is like and how it feels having something that size on the side of the helmet.
 

Obo

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My cameras can be powered remotely, but it means defeating the waterproof seal on them. I find the batteries last about 2 hours, which mates up with the cards I have installed and the resolution I'm running (1080p30.) The colder the temps the shorter the batteries last.

The Polaroid's have a built in battery, non removable. So when they go dead, they need time to recharge. Micro SD card is thru the back waterseal cover (easy access)
The Garmin's have a removable battery, but you have to open them up to get at it. The Micro SD card is under the battery, so a bit more laborious to get to.

Polaroid is the primary helemet camera. I've used it for a bike cam before as well, both front and rear facing.
I've used an GoPro (older Hero2?) bike mounted & rear facing.
I've use the Gamin Virb & Virb Elite bike mounted and rear facing. The Elite has the wifi remote and the GPS tracking which is nice when you're just out wandering randomly places you've never been before and want to check up on it afterwards.

Used the Polaroid & Garmins the car too, both dash mounted and roof rack mounted.

Photos of the camera on the top of the helmet (I didn't like how it looked mounted using the side option.) It has a simple slide on, slide off method of activation.

IMG_1471.JPGIMG_1472.JPG

As for the Virb's I made a custom bracket (2 L brackets - one "flattened") to put the OEM mount on. It runs to the rear reflector under my top case. The bottom pad thing is just there for show more than function. If I remove the side cases it stays just like it is and there's no extra vibration.

IMG_1473.JPGIMG_1474.JPGIMG_1475.JPGIMG_1476.JPG

I'll send the video links direct so you know what's what between each.
 

SupraSabre

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Ugh...I see I've been used in vane once (twice) again! ;)

INNOVV camera looks interesting, but it looks a bit BIG!

INNOVV's first camera system was a bit of a PIA, but I found that the K2 was exactly what I was looking for. Before that, I have spent a number of $$$ on different cameras, including a couple of Heros. What I wanted was something that I could jump on the bike and it would take care of it's self and I could download what I wanted, when I wanted it.

And having it mounted on the 2010, which is the one bike that got hit back in 11/2019, having access to the footage was great!

I've thought of having a camera mounted on the helmet, but decided against it. I do have mounts if I want to mount one of my Heros on the bike for a short video.

Good luck
 

Sadlsor

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I use cameras-- GoPros more for me, than for accident evidence.
I DO appreciate Itchy Boots' multi-camera approach, for the flexibility allowed when editing.
Having used them for years it IS a PITA for casual use, dealing with multiple batteries, multiple cameras, and multiple SD cards.
And for even more fun, try having different generation cameras and learning and remembering the different menu and user interfaces for each different model!
Yeah, few riders will go to that level of masochism.
No 2 of my GoPros are the same model, because by the time I've saved enough to buy another, there are 2 or 3 newer models.
So I often ask myself, "Why am I really doing this?"
Bad enough to juggle all this on a solo ride.
Impossible, on a group ride. You will be despised!
EDIT to add -- if I were to use only one, I prefer helmet mount usually, because you see only road if fixed to the bike, while there is much to be admired off to the sides of the road oft-times. The bike can't see all that.
However, that also means you have to turn your head smoothly (and then can you keep your eyes on the road all the while? very tricky to do!) so as to avoid herky-jerky video.
That is hard to watch, flailing and thrashing around.
Noraly's hand-held videos used at the right time, is another alternative, and are very compelling when she uses it that way.
And THEN, there's 360POV.
How crazy do you want to get?
 
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jfheilman

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I have used bike mounted video cameras for some time (maybe since 2009 or so). In my case I have been using the Contour HD models. I don't remember which model was when but the one now is their 1080P HD. They recently went out of business but might be coming back.

The camera I current have is battery powered (internal battery) and only requires a simple slide swith to be moved to turn the camera on and off. It is currently mounted to the windscreen. I have mounted it under the nose. Under the nose means I have to stop and turn it on and off but I think it does proved better videos of what you are seeing as you travel down the road.
https://contour.com

View of mounting locations. (note Rumble defaults to 480P you have to use the "tool" at the bottom right of the screen to select 1080P.)
Videos from both locations. First is under the nose. Second is on the windscreen. Third shows the cameras ability to handle changes in light.

https://rumble.com/vt17e5-riding-beartooth-and-bighorn-june-2015.html

https://rumble.com/v12yfmi-tight-curves-on-ar-123-headed-south-ozark-national-forest.html

https://rumble.com/vlq6b0-mile-long-tunnel-2015.html

DSCF0029.jpgIMG_0503.JPG
 
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While it will be cool to watch some of my rides for pleasure or edification, i.e. what the heck were you thinking when you did that, it was as much for protection/liability in case of an accident as anything.
I ride with a helmet mounted Sena Prism Tube, and have thought of adding a camera or 2 mounted to the bike... but haven't yet done so. My logic for having one is pretty much yours, cool to look back over previous rides, no real interest in sharing that much, and the insurance use-case.

Opinions vary, but I find that having a helmet mounted camera captures what I'm looking at, combined with the Prism's small profile and microphone internal to the helmet, captures whatever I might be yapping about at the time (I often "talk & ride" and comment about what I'm seeing, about to do, etc. I do the same in the car if I'm by myself).

I have read several times that in many jurisdictions (seems to be more of a European thing) anything such as this camera attached to a motorcycle helmet is illegal.
That's pretty interesting. Here in the UK, perfectly legal to operate. Austria is a 10,000 Euro fine for using a vehicle/helmet mounted camera. Similar in Portugal, while in Luxemburg you can own one, but not use it. Belgium - you'd better not be uploading to YouTube, otherwise you're OK. France is the same as the UK, where evidence has to go to the police before anywhere else (I actually uploaded something from my car after the case was dealt with by the courts, and with permission of the parties involved).

Long story short - EU has no common policy on vehicle mounted cameras, but if you're not planning to ride in Europe, nothing too much to worry about.
 

JJames

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MY 2c : I use the Itchy Boots type ( Pro shot .velcro , chin mount ) with a GoPro , and am very happy with it . The Gopro is easy to turn on and off and check that it is filming - at speed - with one finger. Its easy to take off the helmet - I leave the mount on my helmet.
I also think camera position with the chin mount is the best .It puts you in the drivers seat . Depending on how you tilt the GP ,you capture part of the bike - On the ST you see the some of the dash - Instruments, hands , mirrors- . There is a lot going on ! Your head is pretty stable , and stays level in the twisty''''''''s.
If you stop and talk to someone - you look them right in the face . Half the time nobody even notices the GP- and you forget about it too . A lot of times you come home with great footage you didint even know you had.
I have also mounted the GP on different parts of the bike, But if your running only one camera - in my mind -the chin mount the way to go.
Oh , and it cost the same as a Burger.
 

Sadlsor

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@JJames you must but expensive burgers.
My ProShot, wherein the camera mount broke, was $30.
Been meaning to see if they'll send me another GoPro mount for the chin piece.
It was always extremely difficult to thread in the GoPro bolt, and I tried several.
 
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I have a GoPro Hero 4, Black Edition, bought in 2017.
So, when I got my ST1100, two years ago, I wanted to use it whit my GoPro.

Before gluing any kind of support on my then brand new helmet, I wanted to experiment first.
So I got an action camera helmet chin strap support, from Amazon, for about 20 Canadian dollars.
HelmetStrapChin.jpg
It is not glued, it is just two thin nylon straps (1 cm or half inch wide). So, I can still close my visor, and it doesn't affect my field of vision.


Me too I tought of mounting it on the bike, but I realised that one big advantage of having it on your helmet, is that you can just turn your head and look in the direction of what you want to capture.
A second advantage of having it on your helmet, is that when you park on the street... you can't forget to remove your camera. It stays with the helmet, or I can detach it in 30 seconds.
Another possible advantage : less vibration than directly fixed on a bike part.
And on the chin of the helmet, it is also protected against wind by the windshield.
But, to be honest, I have to admit that (have to choose my words here) from what I saw, those who extract single frames from their videos, while riding at 170 kmh, have lots of blurr in them.
A cool feature of the GoPro is that it can show you your actual speed, thanks to its internal gps.
But... who drives this fast at our ages ? ;)

As for sound now... GoPro camera are a bit tricky. They have a small hole with a microphone inside the device, like cellphones.
But those microphones are very very sensibles. Any simple breeze will make a blowing sound, like most camera when you are recording outside when it is windy.
I bought an outside microphone, like one that you can use with any cellphone or tablet, but discovered that you can't use them with a GoPro.
You need to buy their GoPro microphone adapter (probably adapts the impedance) that they sell for about $100. A real Racket.
I thought, maybe I could use a small audio recorder. And then later add that to the video. But... what do I need to record exactly ? Not sure I really need this feature.
One last thing I want to test one day, is to simply put a piece of temporary tape on the microphone hole.
This will cut all the high frequency noises, but the low rumble frequencies will still go thru. A bit like when are wearing earbuds.
If I ever post one of my riding video on youtube, the only sound will probably be some music with it. And very little text to describe or explain something if needed.

One last thing... I will soon experiment another mode I didn't use much, and that might give better result than video.
I have a mode where I can set the GoPro to take single pictures, every number of second I want : every second, every 3, 5, 10 seconds, etc.
I once noticed that those images are of greather resolution than single frames extracted from video. I guess one picture every seconds might be OK for my need (mainly for capturing beautifull landscape and routes).

I bought some spare batteries and memory cards.
I also have a small rechargeable pack that I can plug in the GoPro and use as an external battery.

And... Oh Yeah. To turn the Camera On or Off, my GoPro is connected to my phone's bluetooth.
So I stop at a secure place, take my phone, start the GoPro using the App, and Voila.
I can also press the little button if I remove my gloves.
 
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Sadlsor

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I've used the photo-every-xx-seconds several times, and then speed them up a timeline in a NLE*, so as to appear like a timelapse.
This can be fun when building something, or showing phases of construction as it progresses.
I use Camtasia, and others, for editing.
*Non-linear editing is a form of offline editing for audio, video, and image editing. In offline editing, the original content is not modified in the course of editing. In non-linear editing, edits are specified and modified by specialized software.
 
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