Motor oil

[PFD023]

Just a heads up to anyone in Canada wanting to order Valvoline Premium Blue One Solution - 4l....go to the Cummins site and with delivery 2-4l jugs came to $56

https://shop.cummins.com/CSSNAStore/s/product/a2w4N000003sJBiQAM/valvoline-premium-blue-one-solution-gen2-891210?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIycLmxv_D9wIVSW5vBB25Aw2zEAQYASABEgLqlvD_BwE

 

[ChriSTian_64]

Just to add some oil on the fire...

Today I changed the oil and filter of my ST1100.
Last time I tried Motul 3000. I had no problem with it.
But this time, I decided to go with the "Pro Honda GN4".
Note that the GN4 is the one recommended in the owner's manual.
Price was reasonable at my local dealer : a gallon (just what I needed) was about $40 Canadian ($31 US).
Alright.



Now, to my big surprise, while looking in my Clymer manual (double checking the torque for the drain bolt) there was a caution note... where they say to only use SF or SG, and never use any SH or SJ oils. What ?



In other words, Clymer says not to use the oil recommended by Honda.



Now, to be fair, the owner's manual does say to use the GN4, but also to use an SF or SG.
How come the only GN4 they sell today is an SJ ?

Is it possible that the SJ has evolved, and today's SJ is as good as yesterday's SG ?
From the sticker on the gallon... that oil IS made for motorcycles and wet clutches.

Anyway... I'll see how it goes. In the worst case, I will have to change my oil again.

 

[Upt' North]

SJ1997 Gasoline Engine Service. Category SJ was adopted in 1996 to describe engine oil first mandated in 1997. It is for use in service typical of gasoline engines in present and earlier passenger cars, vans, and light trucks operating under manufacturers recommended maintenance procedures. Oils meeting API SH requirements have been tested according to the American Chemistry Council (ACC) Product Approval Code of Practice and may utilize the API Base Oil Interchange and Viscosity Grade Engine Testing Guidelines. They may be used where API Service Category SH and earlier categories are recommended.

Big Red's got you covered fella.

 

[ChriSTian_64]

Big Red's got you covered fella.

So, Ray... If I let the clutch go, and the bike doesn't move, it would be one or the other possibility.

Or my clutch is slipping or I am madly burning my rear tyre.

 

[dduelin]

Just to add some oil on the fire...

Today I changed the oil and filter of my ST1100.
Last time I tried Motul 3000. I had no problem with it.
But this time, I decided to go with the "Pro Honda GN4".
Note that the GN4 is the one recommended in the owner's manual.
Price was reasonable at my local dealer : a gallon (just what I needed) was about $40 Canadian ($31 US).
Alright.



Now, to my big surprise, while looking in my Clymer manual (double checking the torque for the drain bolt) there was a caution note... where they say to only use SF or SG, and never use any SH or SJ oils. What ?



In other words, Clymer says not to use the oil recommended by Honda.



Now, to be fair, the owner's manual does say to use the GN4, but also to use an SF or SG.
How come the only GN4 they sell today is an SJ ?

Is it possible that the SJ has evolved, and today's SJ is as good as yesterday's SG ?
From the sticker on the gallon... that oil IS made for motorcycles and wet clutches.

Anyway... I'll see how it goes. In the worst case, I will have to change my oil again.

You cannot go wrong with using GN4.

Some older automotive SJ oils in viscosity grade 10w30 might have friction modifiers in the additive package that might allow the clutch to slip. I suppose Clymer covered all the bases by blacklisting all API SJ oils but SJ motorcycle oils like GN4 carrying the JASO MA rating are safe to use. The JASO MA certification overrides any general admonition not to use an SJ. A careful reading of your owner and service manual, depending on the year, show 'API Classification SG or higher' The API grades are successive so SJ is higher than SF, SG & SH.

 

[RaYzerman]

I've gone down rabbit holes researching..... basically with SL and up, friction modifiers increased. JASO has a friction requirement. That GN4 is fine. Owner's manuals become obsolete eventually, perhaps consult the latest Owner's Manual available...... e.g., Yamaha manual from early 2000's didn't even mention JASO even though that was out years before. The later ones included it. Viscosity range was expanded also in keeping with the times.

 

[Andrew Shadow]

In other words, Clymer says not to use the oil recommended by Honda.

The Honda manual most likely states to use SJ oil that does not have Energy Conserving, Energy Conserving II, or Resource Conserving listed on the container. With SJ oil it could be just SJ service rated oil, or it could be SJ service rated oil with additional friction modifiers. If it had the additional friction modifiers, it would also have the Energy Conserving, Energy Conserving II, or Resource Conserving (I don't remember the time line for each so I have listed them all) descriptor as well. With SJ rated oils, this had to be listed on the label. One of the reasons Honda called for SJ rated oil for so long after it had been surpassed is because it is the last service rating where the presence of these friction modifiers had to be listed on the label, so there is a means to know if these additives are present or not.

The lack of Energy Conserving, Energy Conserving II, or Resource Conserving on the label no longer means anything. This does not have to be listed any longer for many service categories, and in some cases it is no longer allowed to be listed even if these friction modifiers are present, so this is no longer a reliable measure for determining wet-clutch compatibility.

 

[ChriSTian_64]

Thanks everyone for your comments. Yeah, I found that Clymer note pretty confusing.

I bought it new two years ago, but my printed edition of the Clymer manual is from 2002 (first edition).
I guess that caution note to avoid SJ oils was probably OK 20 years ago, but is less true these days, since now even the Honda GN4 is rated SJ.

 

[Chris09]

Clymer has no skin in the game; nobody's gonna take their bike to Clymer and say ... "... Hey... you guys printed... and, look what happened..." I understand that some people have found them and Haynes to print some good publications but I've found them both to run just about a neck and neck first and second in the worse than useless claimer category.
I'm in complete agreement with the well explained and articulated earlier poster who effectively postulates that Honda has some accountablility [... I think about what a man would like, then I take away reason... and accountability...] in what they endorse; if they want an extra ten or fifteen bucks for it, WGAS; I don't resent them because they can be undercut; they have a business model that isn't bad. For me it's gonna be GN4 10-40 and I don't care what's in the bottle.

 

[W0QNX]

Just curious, what oil are you guys using?

Rotella T6 15W40 or 5W40 when they don't have the 15W40. Supertech 6607 oil filter. I just did my 330,000 mile oil change. Oil changed every 10,000 miles since 1,000 on the bike same oil always same filter usually. I did measure my between changes consumption this time, accurately even. I added 9 one ounce jiggers of oil at about the 7,000 mile in point to bring it up to the center of the level hole. So it's using just over none per change. 35 oil changes. Around the world distance 13.25 times on the original clutch and I've saved a grove of oil trees doing the changes at 10,000 mile intervals instead of 3,000 or 8,000.

I didn't read the entire thread. I'm sure someone might have said this oil isn't second party certified and therefore must be unfit for ST1300 use so YMMV and make your own decisions. The jug I used smelled good when installed. It had a earthy peat mossy smell and was probably aged in an plastic cask for 3 months.

Before change oil level:




Adding the good stuff:




After change oil level with 4 quarts and new 6607 filter:

 

[Chris09]

I just went earlier today and bought a jug of what is it, something 4 [$63.00] for my 42R ... can't remember Dodge automatic, was looking at the oil shelf at the local Canadian Tire, Rotella T6 15/40W was also over $60/gal [Canadian] so my $56.00 dollar GN 4 oil wasn't so bad.
Must be spring.

 

[Paulgroovy]

I’m not recommending any oil to anyone, but when folks ask what I am using, this is what I use….

How often do you change your oil? If I'm not mistaken honda recomends every 12,000kms for the st1300. How far do you go on an oil change and how does it look when you change it? Thanks.

 

[Esti1300]

FWIW @Paulgroovy, I use a full synthetic JASO certified MA2 rating oil and feel comfortable going to 10k kms before changing + oil change prior to winter storage. Works so far for me. YMMV.

And by the way, welcome to this forum from Eastern Ontario

 

[Paulgroovy]

FWIW @Paulgroovy, I use a full synthetic JASO certified MA2 rating oil and feel comfortable going to 10k kms before changing + oil change prior to winter storage. Works so far for me. YMMV.

And by the way, welcome to this forum from Eastern Ontario

@Esti1300 thanks for the warm welcome, appreciate it. I see you're a Rush fan. Best rock band perhaps ever.

Anyoo, what brand of oil do you use? I was thinking of using Motul 7100 10w40 because it has the best reviews on Amazon. Then I come here and see some guys don't like it and are having better luck wth HD 15w40 oil for diesels. I have some Motul 3000 10w40 I bought for my Versys 650 I just sold to buy my ST1300. What do you use? Thanks

 

[Willsmotorcycle]

@Esti1300 thanks for the warm welcome, appreciate it. I see you're a Rush fan. Best rock band perhaps ever.

Anyoo, what brand of oil do you use? I was thinking of using Motul 7100 10w40 because it has the best reviews on Amazon. Then I come here and see some guys don't like it and are having better luck wth HD 15w40 oil for diesels. I have some Motul 3000 10w40 I bought for my Versys 650 I just sold to buy my ST1300. What do you use? Thanks

Welcome if I have not yet conveyed this, go back and read the whole 11 page thread and you will find there is no consensus on brand, only specifications(mostly ). Use an oil that meets Honda specs... if you're not convinced, there are numerous oil threads just like this on, there will be another one along shortly as well. Enjoy, happy reading and riding.

 

[Esti1300]

what brand of oil do you use? I was thinking of using Motul 7100 10w40

Well, I haven’t had any problems with that choice in Motul. I have also used Liquid Moly 4T Street 10W40 as well as Maxima Extra 4T 10W40 with no issues. IMHO, Motul provided me with the best clutch feel and responsiveness but only marginally. Just my experience.

FWIW, I’m not aware of any diesel oils that have a JASO certification.

 

[STumped]

FWIW, I’m not aware of any diesel oils that have a JASO certification.

Uh, oh. Here we go....

hehehe

 

[Paulgroovy]

Well, I haven’t had any problems with that choice in Motul. I have also used Liquid Moly 4T Street 10W40 as well as Maxima Extra 4T 10W40 with no issues. IMHO, Motul provided me with the best clutch feel and responsiveness but only marginally. Just my experience.

FWIW, I’m not aware of any diesel oils that have a JASO certification.

When I used the Motul 3000 in my Versys I immediately noticed a difference. It was shifting much much smoother. Perhaps I'll give it a try in the ST.

 

[Oldbikefixr]

Welcome aboard! Lots of practices and opinions on this board, all right on or pretty near on the mark.
My problem with oil is that modern oils last longer than my comfort zone. I change it with factory recommended weights and brand name JASO-MA2 conforming oils...just read the fine print on the label. I change my oil every 6,000 miles or after 12 months. Plus, I keep an eye on its color weekly, about 10 minutes after a ride,....wipe the lens clean with one of those long foam tipped q-tip style swabs and use a little flashlight. This also gives me a quick indication about oil consumption, so far that isn't noticeable.
Every time I watch the oil pour out into the pan I think 'why am I doing this so soon'. I've considered the factory recommendation but my OCD just won't permit it.

How often do you change your oil? If I'm not mistaken honda recomends every 12,000kms for the st1300. How far do you go on an oil change and how does it look when you change it? Thanks.

 

[Paulgroovy]

Welcome aboard! Lots of practices and opinions on this board, all right on or pretty near on the mark.
My problem with oil is that modern oils last longer than my comfort zone. I change it with factory recommended weights and brand name JASO-MA2 conforming oils...just read the fine print on the label. I change my oil every 6,000 miles or after 12 months. Plus, I keep an eye on its color weekly, about 10 minutes after a ride,....wipe the lens clean with one of those long foam tipped q-tip style swabs and use a little flashlight. This also gives me a quick indication about oil consumption, so far that isn't noticeable.
Every time I watch the oil pour out into the pan I think 'why am I doing this so soon'. I've considered the factory recommendation but my OCD just won't permit it.

Thanks for the warm welcome @Oldbikefixr. Perhaps I'll try out the Motul 3000 for my first oil change. However the Valvoline Premium Blue is very interesting to me.