Replacement for the Honda ST1300 in 20??

[ST13Fred]

Re: Replacement for the Honda ST1300 in 2014? A short article with responses.

-Engine: I, for one, don't need more power. How about a bit of tweaking to get better MPG out of it? 40mpg on the highway is silly for a long distance motorcycle. BMW and most others beat it. I can cruise at 70mph in many cages and do better than my ST does. I love the smoothness of the V-4, and the electric-motor like power. Keep it longitudinal. Honda is different...stay that way. Add a 6th gear.

All BMWs' (autos included) get good fuel mileage because they have higher compression engines, with more bang for the buck during the fuel burn. Honda products have lower compression, but more longevity, so that is the trade off. Putting on aftermarket items to increase power will hurt longevity and decrease the value of the bike, IMO, which is why I prefer to leave it in good running stock condition. If more power in wanted, buy a stock bike with more power. All this other stuff is how the retail industry separates people from their money.

 

[PanmanPeter]

Re: Replacement for the Honda ST1300 in 2014? A short article with responses.

A few thoughts to add to this thread....(although I agree with others that some suggestions will be a bit late if Honda really are launching in a year or 2)

Leave the engine alone, unless you can find a few more ponies without sacrificing its smooth turbine feel.
Stay with 5 gears! Only sports bikes need 6 and I like the fact it pulls strong in top gear without having to change gear for an overtake/acceleration.
Improve that pathetic horn. It's embarrassing for a big bike and was useless when I really needed it!
Move the indicator warning lights to the bottom of the console. I am 6 foot and cannot see them.
Please please make the service intervals longer than the ridiculous 4,000 miles. Both my cars have 12,000 mile service intervals!
Heated grips and top box as standard fitment

 

[Blrfl]

Re: Replacement for the Honda ST1300 in 2014? A short article with responses.

Improve that pathetic horn. It's embarrassing for a big bike and was useless when I really needed it!

ST, Hyundai and Subaru all came with exactly the same "beep-beep" horn, as did my 1983 Datsun and most of the Japanese cars I've ever rented. I suspect, but have never been able to confirm, that some Asian countries specify a standard car horn sound, and that's why they come that way.

--Mark

 

[nhdiesel]

Re: Replacement for the Honda ST1300 in 2014? A short article with responses.

All BMWs' (autos included) get good fuel mileage because they have higher compression engines, with more bang for the buck during the fuel burn. Honda products have lower compression, but more longevity, so that is the trade off. Putting on aftermarket items to increase power will hurt longevity and decrease the value of the bike, IMO, which is why I prefer to leave it in good running stock condition. If more power in wanted, buy a stock bike with more power. All this other stuff is how the retail industry separates people from their money.

Usually there is a tradeoff between power and economy/reliability. We only get reliability. The feel of the V4 is great, but we only have average or below power for the class. But we also have low economy numbers.

Sent from my XT881 using Tapatalk 2

 

[ST13Fred]

Re: Replacement for the Honda ST1300 in 2014? A short article with responses.

Improve that pathetic horn. It's embarrassing for a big bike and was useless when I really needed it!

I improved the factory horn on my bike by adding another factory horn off the same OEM bracket, 'tuned' both horns for max volume via the adjusting set screws, had hi/lo toned horns
and slotted the fairing for sound exit (to match the OEM location). I did not take pics at the time (the bike is now sold, regretfully) but it looked great and sounded even better.

The horns are adjustable for max sound. I've done this many times on my cars and bikes over the years.

 

[ST13Fred]

Re: Replacement for the Honda ST1300 in 2014? A short article with responses.

there is a tradeoff between power and economy/reliability. We only get reliability. average or below power for the class. But we also have low economy numbers.

I agree with what you say, but it is splitting hairs for one to say the ST13 is down on power when comparing it to say, a C14. One day I passed a vehicle thinking I was in 3rd when in fact I was in 2nd gear when I wacked the throttle.
I'll never forget how my grip started coming loose from the bars, the bike was pulling so hard. There is nothing wimping about the power of this bike.

Also, Power and Economy can be on the same side of the equation (many times they are not, though) with Reliability suffering. My F800 is capable of 70+ MPG. Its' #ers': torque 63, hp 85, wt 460, cr 12:1.

 

[HejDuke]

Re: Replacement for the Honda ST1300 in 2014? A short article with responses.

Nailed it, nhdiesel.

Well, here's my :tc1:
With all due respect to Honda's 11 year old, unchanged ST1300 platform, at a minimum, a refresh is warranted. Yamaha is an excellent example of what a refresh can bring to the similarly aged FJR1300 platform, now in its 3rd generation. Here's RIDER Magazine's first test of the new FJR1300; a worthwhile read. Check out the additional links on that page and you'll find the 2013 sport-touring shootout. The venerable FJR1300 platform garnered respect and came away as the bike with the "most bang for the buck." This, in the present company of the all new Trophy SE, the powerful C14, the updated R1200RT, and the mighty K1600GT. Yamaha has kept their platform current, implementing improvements along the way and making some wonderful refinements. Disappointingly, Honda has done none of this for our beloved ST1300. Sure, some will say, "it's good enough as it is". It's worth mentioning, however, that the Honda ST1300 was notably absent from the shootout without consideration.

So, could the Honda ST1300 use a little "refining" of its own? Without question. Honda should start by taking a page out of Yamaha's R&D playbook. Their time would also be well spent paying a little more attention to the market and to this forum. I, for one, would prefer Honda take a more innovative approach, challenge themselves with some forward thinking and dominate with a competitive response to the K1600GT/GTL.

 

[SupraSabre]

Re: Replacement for the Honda ST1300 in 2014? A short article with responses.

Just before the '91 750 Nighthawk was released, I ran into a Honda test group, testing it on Angeles Forest Hwy (that right off the Angeles Crest Hwy). At the time I had a VF700Sabre and when I saw the Nighthawk, I was very disappointed. Gone was the Hydraulic clutch and the shaftdrive. (Two reasons why I never bought one.) When I asked the rep why, they said that they would have to increase the price $500 and they didn't feel that it would be "Priced right". I never thought they would care about $500 like that, but they did.

So relating that experience to the ST1300, personally, I'm glad they have kept it like it is for so long. When i was riding the mid 80's V45 &V65 Sabres (and the 700) from 1987 to 2005, one of the hardest things was finding parts. Maybe I'm not a very exciting person or something, because when I find some thing I like and works well for me, I don't grow bored with it, as many of you on the forum has. If the bike no longer excites you, by all means try something else! But the good thing, there will be plenty of ST1300s and parts for me and probably the rest of my riding career!

I love the ST1300, yeah, I have to add certain Farkles to make it comfortable, but one size does not fit all without some adjustments!

 

[Nevada]

Re: Replacement for the Honda ST1300 in 2014? A short article with responses.

Please please make the service intervals longer than the ridiculous 4,000 miles. Both my cars have 12,000 mile service intervals!

What are your cars' oil capacities? Much of the increase in car svc intervals is due to bumping up the oil capacity. You won't be able to "leave the engine alone" if you add another 2-3qts of oil.

Heated grips and top box as standard fitment

Nope. I've got no use for heated grips, and while I think the top box shouldn't cost $1,000 to add to the bike, checking out the parking lot at any ST event will show that about 1/3 of riders don't go for the top box.

 

[HAMMR]

Re: Replacement for the Honda ST1300 in 2014? A short article with responses.

Haven't see prices, but one could probably buy a pristine 70s CB750 for less and have something that's appreciating.

I had a CB750 back in my Ft Hood days. My first bike was a 90cc but as a grown up kid my first bike was that 750. Wore out I-35 on that thing.

 

[dduelin]

Re: Replacement for the Honda ST1300 in 2014? A short article with responses.

What are your cars' oil capacities? Much of the increase in car svc intervals is due to bumping up the oil capacity. You won't be able to "leave the engine alone" if you add another 2-3qts of oil.

My Honda and Acura cars hold 4 to 4.5 qts of oil. The difference is my car doesn't share its engine lubricating oil with the transmission with it's gears that chop up the long chain polymers that make up the "multi" in multiviscosity oil. Still, Honda states 8,000 miles between engine oil changes which is long for a motorcycle.

The increase in car service intervals is due to better and better oils along with tighter and tighter production tolerances in the engines. They have come a long way in the last 20 years.

 

[PQ11]

It is funny to realise that when we read the maintenance book in kilometers, it changes the maintenance intervals in the head ! Everyone changes the oil at 5000 kilometers in Qu?bec, Canada. Why ? In the book they recommand 12,800 kilometers, which is 8000 miles. And I read on STOwners that the majority of riders change their oil at 5000 miles. Bizarre no ?

Top case are usefull, esthetic maybe, but so horrible on CX (penetration in the air with turbulences). Why the companies that are aware of that but does not adapt a luggage capacity best adapted to this contraint ? Lower the weight and avoid turbulences installing a case at the level of the stop light, all the back of vehicule as a trunk ?

Lower the weight helps to drive without turbulences of the top cases that are to high and too small.

 

[George]

Re: Replacement for the Honda ST1300 in 2014? A short article with responses.

I still doubt the "chopped polymer chains" for oil longevity. My 88 Civic stick recommended 10W30 auto oil in the tranny with a 30,000 mile change interval. I still believe Honda engineers know more about it than we do.

With nearly 500,000 miles on my 3 1100s, I change my oil at extended intervals.

 

[PQ11]

Re: Replacement for the Honda ST1300 in 2014? A short article with responses.

I still doubt the "chopped polymer chains" for oil longevity. My 88 Civic stick recommended 10W30 auto oil in the tranny with a 30,000 mile change interval. I still believe Honda engineers know more about it than we do.

With nearly 500,000 miles on my 3 1100s, I change my oil at extended intervals.

I will change my oil in the future at 5 th miles. Thanks...for savings !

 

[Pelagic]

Re: Replacement for the Honda ST1300 in 2014? A short article with responses.

Big fan of Honda in past with ST's both 1100 & 1300 over 100k worth. Look at history of H (Honda). For most of life they have made things the public wants. At this time it isn't what we the fans of ST's like to hear, but as with the recent intro of the 500 and 700 CC bikes this is the path they are taking, because the GLOBAL demand is there, not just here in states. Japan and USA both had 54k units sold in 2012. Asia had 2741k units same period and S. America and Africa had combined 550k units in '12. Right now here the Cbr250r is one of the USA biggest seller for Honda. Scooters are taking off like hot cakes in the metro areas which attribute (unfortunately ) to the sales as much as we don't want to believe this. So, they are shifting production and design towards this for the future. I now am riding the Yamaha Super Tenere, and also wish H would bring the CrossTourer here in this growing age of Adv Touring.

I stumbled upon a Honda photo-shoot the other day here in SoCal and got to chat with the Honda marketing guy for a few minutes while the press corps took turns swapping bikes and getting their pictures taken on some nearby switchbacks. He agrees with your observations. The units just aren't there to support a major refurb of the ST which would be expensive. And more ST riders are moving towards the adventure side of the equation like the GS or the new Tenere drawing into some doubt the future growth in units of the ST segment. I wonder about the impact of the success of the ST-P on it, there's a lot of units there, but suspect that, because of the government procurement process, that success only makes "no major changes" a more likely outcome, not less.

My ST is at 124k miles and while I consider that to only be it's half-life, I'm thinking about what's next. I'm probably going to add something to my garage over the winter (such as it is in LA) for 2014. I asked him what the chances of an updated ST were and he said, and I quote; "don't hold your breath". Honda is clearly tarting up the 'Wing to capture some HD defectors but I told him that as much as I like that bike, and as well as it performs, it's a Buick. .

I'm a Honda fan, even drive an Acura, but it looks like my next bike is going to leave the fold. I just can't see putting a new copy of a 10 year old bike in the garage, as near-perfect as it still seems to be, and I don't see myself riding a Buick any time soon.

 

[ruut66]

Re: Replacement for the Honda ST1300 in 2014? A short article with responses.

Hi, Your article is very well researched and clearly you know what you are talking about. I couldnt say I disagree with any of it....However, things must change eventually and its probable that the new ST will be different in some way. The ST1300 has been described as the Lexus of motorbikes, and for good reason. I bought a new Lexus RX450 so I know what that means....Before I bought the ST1300 I spent nearly a year on and off researching the purchase. My initial choice was the BMW. However I consulted many police forces, both in the USA and Canada, and also in the UK. Without exception, they said 'avoid BMW' and go for Honda or various other Jap makes. Some of these motor officers rode Sts themselves. Hence my decision to go for an ST although in some ways the BMW has nicer curves. However, I have no regrets, and if Honda bring out a new version, I am happy to support a new purchase, should I be happy with the ride and design. Im the meantime, my present ST would do me 2 more lifetimes if need be. There is just nothing like the confidence that engine whine instills when the trottle is opened up on the open road.........Happy days...

 

[montyshaw]

Re: Replacement for the Honda ST1300 in 2014? A short article with responses.

All BMWs' (autos included) get good fuel mileage because they have higher compression engines, with more bang for the buck during the fuel burn. Honda products have lower compression, but more longevity, so that is the trade off. Putting on aftermarket items to increase power will hurt longevity and decrease the value of the bike, IMO, which is why I prefer to leave it in good running stock condition. If more power in wanted, buy a stock bike with more power. All this other stuff is how the retail industry separates people from their money.

Fred - Hey man, you're in WV now? Let's go to the races! Come on, you know you want to slam a nice bobble head on the dash of the ST with a glob of silicone like the ole PC.

The only thing I want in a new ST is Cruise Control. The rest of the bike is perfect, except for the suspension (upgraded mine with Traxxion Dynamix carts up front, and Penske 1400lber in the rear), and the seat (Russell Day long FTW).

Monty

 

[PQ11]

Re: Replacement for the Honda ST1300 in 2014? A short article with responses.

Buy Phantom cruise control. 20$ And it does the job.

 

[montyshaw]

Re: Replacement for the Honda ST1300 in 2014? A short article with responses.

Buy Phantom cruise control. 20$ And it does the job.

I already have a 'real' cruise, the audiovox. Much better than a throttle lock. I want it built in, like on the FJR.

Monty

 

[PQ11]

Re: Replacement for the Honda ST1300 in 2014? A short article with responses.

An intelligent cruise control that keeps the chosen speed up and down the hills is the real thing. But the trottle lock is a very economic alternative and does the job in most of the situations, in my perception.