steering head bearings - some queries

[GGely]

Lol, I’m sure Igofar does these every day! I do one a month or so, so I think practice and familiarity helps a lot.

Heck, you’re restoring a 1954 Matchless, aren’t you? NoFearAsterysk, they call you, don’t they?!

 

[aSTerix]

Lol, I’m sure Igofar does these every day! I do one a month or so, so I think practice and familiarity helps a lot.

Heck, you’re restoring a 1954 Matchless, aren’t you? NoFearAsterysk, they call you, don’t they?!

This was my first time converting a ball bearing setup to taper bearing and I my first time working with taper bearing head stem, I am so grateful for all the assistance I received on the forum. Having done it now I would know what to do next time .... get the proper tools !

The 1954 Matchless is in its third strip-down and rebuild, I initially decided to do the frame and engine and now its turned into a major rebuild ! Its nice switching between the old and new (relatively) but I keep wondering if should modernise the Matchless a bit !! (Its magneto and dynamo and 6v and +ve ground) but then I feel I want to keep it close to original

 

[MillCreekMadman]

This was my first time converting a ball bearing setup to taper bearing and I my first time working with taper bearing head stem, I am so grateful for all the assistance I received on the forum. Having done it now I would know what to do next time .... get the proper tools !

The 1954 Matchless is in its third strip-down and rebuild, I initially decided to do the frame and engine and now its turned into a major rebuild ! Its nice switching between the old and new (relatively) but I keep wondering if should modernise the Matchless a bit !! (Its magneto and dynamo and 6v and +ve ground) but then I feel I want to keep it close to original

Hey aSTerix, can you point me to the bearings you used please.

 

[aSTerix]

Hey aSTerix, can you point me to the bearings you used please.

I bought All Balls taper bearings from ebay USA , they fitted nicely.

 

[Ron]

I have purchased taper roller bearings with seals as a set from Charlie at cbrbearing.com . old email address: -cbr@tfb.com

5) The inside of my steering stem is very rusty, there is a plastic cap at the bottom but nothing on the top, this seems strange to me, am I missing a part or should I squirt some oil in there or just ignore it and let it rust !

I would think there would be one on the top so nothing got in the tube. Open bottom so it drains or falls out. Somewhere out there is a plastic plug that fits the ST stem. I think it is from a VFR but not sure if that's true or what year. Anyone else recall this? example -not a known fit - item #13

www.partsfish.com/oemparts/a/hon/5053f621f870021c54be7d77/handlebar-top-bridge

EDIT: I found this on a search: "Looking at the instructions I received with my Heli-Bars, they state that the steering stem plug from a 1998 VFR800 will fit the ST1100 steering stem hole. Honda part No. 53232-MJ4-670."

There is also a chrome dome nut from another bike that replaces the one on the ST. Don't remember what bike but I have one on an ST.

EDIT: I found this with a search: "Got mine back in 07 from Zanotti Motor Co. Part number 95020-11300. It is a polished chrome steering stem nut. Has been used on numerous Hondas throughout the years. Lists around $15, I paid $9.15."

 

[dwalby]

5) The inside of my steering stem is very rusty, there is a plastic cap at the bottom but nothing on the top, this seems strange to me, am I missing a part or should I squirt some oil in there or just ignore it and let it rust !

I would think there would be one on the top so nothing got in the tube.

Nothing is missing. I think since the stock setup from the factory includes a plastic handlebar cover, Honda chose to not plug that hole under the assumption that the bar cover would keep water out well enough to not need it. Once the bar cover is removed for HeliBar installation, you need to go with one of the options you noted in your reply for plugging that hole.

 

[MillCreekMadman]

I performed the taper roller bearing change. I can now take my hands off the bars and have zero shake/shimmy. However, it seems that i now have a low 20mph weave. I did read that a weave is an indication of over tight steering stem bearings. How is proper bearing compression determined? Anything better than guess and test?

 

[dwalby]

I performed the taper roller bearing change. I can now take my hands off the bars and have zero shake/shimmy. However, it seems that i now have a low 20mph weave. I did read that a weave is an indication of over tight steering stem bearings. How is proper bearing compression determined? Anything better than guess and test?

If you have them too tight you'll know, the steering will feel 'stiff' and the bike won't flop over into a turn like it should.

What I found with mine is trial and error worked better than trying to use any published values in a manual. If you elevate the front wheel off the ground, grab a lower fork tube in each hand, and push fore/aft rapidly, you shouldn't feel any clicking, if you do its too loose. Keep tightening little by little until the click goes away, and you'll be set, it shouldn't be too tight.

If its way too tight you'll notice the steering symptom I mentioned, and you'll also notice that if you try to turn the elevated front wheel from lock to lock there's a noticeable resistance to movement.

However, depending on how well you got the new races seated in the steering stem, it may loosen up by riding it for a few hundred miles or so as the races get pounded further into the stem by road impacts. So, if its just a little tight you may want to ride it a while and see if it loosens up on its own. If its a lot tight then you probably want to re-adjust it.

 

[Bmacleod]

To get the proper preload, I elevated the completed front end and used a luggage scale to test the pull required to turn the forks from one side to the other. 5 lbs. seems to work nicely

 

[MillCreekMadman]

@dwalby. Ive got about 150 miles on the new bearings. I think ill play with the bearing compression this weekend. I would assume that the race is seated by now. Thanks for the instruction.

@Bmacleod. Thanks for the suggestion. I think i can find a small load cell to perform the 5lb test.

 

[kiltman]

The low weave is a bit scary. The torque value is less than the roller bearings. The previous posts address how to adjust. In theory you’re supposed to check them after the first 600 miles that’s more crucial for roller bearings.
I only had them checked on my 1990. While on my 97 and 2002 I didn’t and they are fine from the initial install.

 

[Haytch]

Just in the process of replacing my steering bearings and found this thread very useful. Thank you for everyone's input. Particularly regarding the positioning of the adjuster locknut.

In the article Shaking the Shakes the writer refers to the original Honda Service Letter no126 for technical reference. The Honda Service Letter gives a suggested torque loading of 22-29 Ft.Lbs to 'seat' the bearings and then after backing off the adjusting nut to apply 9 to 17 in.lbs. However the figure of 7-10 Ft.lbs is given in the Shaking the Shakes article for this setting torque (which is 84 to 120 in.lbs) I think this is a typo?
Obviously proceeding onward to complete the work on the bearings will normally mean testing the resistance of the steering stem to rotate ( 5lb when measured at the stanchion...the effect of the pre-load that has been introduced). If over torquing has occurred due to applying the wrong torque loading it will be evident and loosening of the adjuster nut will correct it. Interestingly the Honda Service Letter makes no mention of this pre-load check test, and many owners without a pull tester (spring balance) may not bother. I would expect them later to notice that the bike wont self steer, but this induced fault could have been avoided.