The electric PAN - ST1300 - my next project.

[Larry Fine]

Talk to an electrician.

I'm an electrician. Good suggestion, although conventional welding or mechanical adapting might be stronger.

The only discrepancy between your description and my experience is that all of the charge was poured on top of the disc in the brand/type of molds that I used.

Here are a few shots I made at a cellular tower site I did the ground work on a few years ago. The bare wire is tinned solid #2 copper:

 

[SMSW]

thanksSMSW

Sounds like a good option , do you have a Link to it , so I can picture it better ?

tony

Here are links: Cadweld, Another is Exothermic Welding, and yet another is Hanger's Ultrashot.
The first and third are brands, the wiki link explains the process a bit but there is more info online and doubtless youtube videos. You could probably make your own, but the results might be iffy and ahhhhh exciting.

 

[lrhsr05st1300]

can't wait to see finished project

 

[technotony007]

Here are links: Cadweld, Another is Exothermic Welding, and yet another is Hanger's Ultrashot.
The first and third are brands, the wiki link explains the process a bit but there is more info online and doubtless youtube videos. You could probably make your own, but the results might be iffy and ahhhhh exciting.

Thanks Smsw ,
At the moment that looks like a good option. The only deeps concerns I have, ( thinking out loud!!) is when the Exothermic reaction occurs , the heat generated may compromise the Coupling bearings which joins the two half's universal coupling together. The Fatigue and stress due to the heat to thing small bearing /fastening attachments and the potential cost / damage to the assembly if these parted could be dangerous. ( if I am haring along a 70 to 90 mph on motorway.)

If it does not effect these coupling bearing then it sounds perfect , depending of the set density of the material. ( for wear and cracking )

so I think anything which heat in the process is off my consideration list.

I think once I have the gap between the back plate ( onto the frame ) to which the motor is fitted , and the shaft coupling... then I think may need .

If gap to long - a brass splined outer bush with a matched shaft and keyway to the motor. ( specialist machined part.)

or
If the motor shaft and keyway Gap is none and it can mate with splined coupling , use a cool forming Chemical metal to the two together.

if that make sense !!!!!

Until I make the back plate and marry up the ME1616 motor to it , I can assess it properly at that point.

regards

tony

 

[jfheath]

Just backtracking a couple of pages:

First the swingarm. It took me a while work out how much gap on each side to, I think this is correct. (please let me know if I got it wrong. Could not find the gap in the Manual.)

If you are still using that copy of the ST1300 manual that I gave you, the swing arm mounting has changed since then. Sometime around 2003/4. Which may or may not have anything to do with anything else related to the Pan around that time. I couldn't say.

I'll send you a PM with some attachments in a tick. I have to go and clap right now.

 

[SMSW]

so I think anything which heat in the process is off my consideration list.

I'm having a bit of difficulty picturing where and how this heat sensitive coupling will be a part of the drive train. But, consider this. The one shot type made by Erico Co - they make Cadweld is a plaster or clay cylinder with a horizontal hole at the bottom maybe half an inch up (from the bottom) and a heavy rubber gasket on the bottom with a hole in the center. You slide the cylinder over your ground rod - said gasket fits snugly. The ground wire goes in the hole over the top of the ground rod and an aluminum disk is dropped inside the mold. It drops down maybe an inch from the top. The powder is poured inside, the cap with a hole is placed on top, and the igniting powder is poured in the depression on the cap. The user then ignites the powder with a sparker (much like the spark provided by a zippo lighter or butane lighter). As the reaction proceeds (with much smoke and sparks) the aluminum disk melts and the molten metal falls through on top of the wire and ground rod. Since it is a comparatively small volume, it cools very quickly. I have pulled these off the ground rod surprised to find the rubber gasket only partially melted.

Should you seriously consider welding or this thermite system, you could wrap wet rags around the critical parts. Plumbing supply houses also sell heat absorbing products that do the same thing as the wet rag - limit incidental heating when soldering - say a valve with composite valve seats, packing, etc. Good luck and keep us posted.

 

[Al st1100]

If the drive shaft end is not PERFECTLY centered you will end up with a vibration

 

[T_C]

I'm going to venture out and say for safety, reliability and peace of mind, this should be a machined coupling. Something solid and balanced, turned on a lathe. Pound wise not penny foolish. Save the pence elsewhere.

 

[xrcris]

I'm just posting this for motivation. Interpret that however you want.

 

[technotony007]

I'm just posting this for motivation. Interpret that however you want.

Hopefully mine will not be as complicated as that , and the aim of looking just the same except for the missing exhaust silencers and downpipe

 

[ST Gui]

except for the missing exhaust silencers and downpipe

That would be a head turner and scratcher!

 

[Catmandu2]

I'm just posting this for motivation. Interpret that however you want.

Oh,,, that is a Massive !! massive battery,,, massive driven gear on the right rear,,, etc,,,

 

[Northerntour]

NEVER underestimate the British, many have over the history of time, and they almost always were wrong!
I believe this is going to happen just the way you envisioned it.

KEEP CALM AND CARRY ON.

 

[technotony007]

Update 25.11.2020


Well ladies & Gents,

I thought it was about time , I gave an update on my Electric pan project to date. I have had a few bum steers and followed the wrong paths but think now I am heading on the right one.

I purchase a number of Nissan leaf gen 4 batteries, with a view to buy 14 in total, but I got my calculations wrong , ( i.e. basically 14 wouldn’t fit , were I thought it would in the engine area, )

So, I will need to consider another flexible battery method, but I think I need to start from a base design and adapt accordingly , so as a start I need to build the battery cage, mount in the frame. Then fit the engine in place with a drive shaft connected.

I took the standard Honda drive shaft coupling design, and decided I needed to be able to attach one end to the standard drive shaft splines , and the other would need to match the key way shaft design of the Electric motor.

The universal coupling from the drive shaft to the standard ICE looked like this.






I took the coupling to a local machinists , discussed a few methods to adapt this , and arrived at a design by which , a specific machined items , would be shrunk fit onto the ICE end of the coupling , and welded in place. They made the adapter below, so the coupling would then fit the keyway shaft drive to match the electric motor I have purchased.





Cost for the conversion was £50.



The battery cage was then rough designed, from a 6mm mild steel plate profile and measured up. I made up a rough sketch, then had this manufactured, by a local sheet metalwork company.

Cost roughly about £150

I then trail fitted in the frame as below,

The next task is to mark and cut out, notch the battery cage, so it is a tight fit. Inside the engine bay. Mark, centre punch and drill the bolt holes, so the cage is a solid secure fit inside the engine bay, and too be rigid enough to prevent torsion and twisting of the frame.

Finally, mark out the drive shaft hole, then cut out. Followed by the secure fitting of the modified coupling onto the standard drive and see where is sits (and measure) from the rear plate of the battery cage.



Next task after this, will be to mount the engine in accordance with this measurement, design, fabricate a bracket in mount the engine in place. so, the whole assembly is in line (as straight as possible.)


I will post an update at this point, as I believe this will be the most bespoke and fiddliest part of the project.

Until then Stay safe everyone

regards

Tony

 

[Obo]

Hopefully your key will be made out of something a bit more robust then steel. I'd worry that the torque from the electric motor might shear the key off. (Which might be better than snapping the U joint!)

 

[Upt' North]

Thanks Tony, nice update.
I think your direction now is the right one, but time will tell.
Does Er'Indoors know you've got Er Axminster under the frame?
Did I see a bike being sold by you recently, or was it a dream?
Upt'North.

 

[Turbine2]

Excellent progress. It’s all a learning journey. Looking forward to the next update.

 

[Upt' North]

Just thought Tony, will the vehicle have to be IVA tested before registration? Although something is telling me that the engine only carries one point on the IVA. It'd be interesting to know.
Upt'North.

 

[technotony007]

Thanks Tony, nice update.
I think your direction now is the right one, but time will tell.
Does Er'Indoors know you've got Er Axminster under the frame?
Did I see a bike being sold by you recently, or was it a dream?
Upt'North.

yes, i managed to liberate a few offcuts of carpets to assist with the build.

yes my Grey Pan st 1300 is for sale for £2600 on ebay , I am only selling it to finance this project and make so more spare in my garage.

my pocket money sadly these days does not stretch very far

regards

Tony

 

[technotony007]

Just thought Tony, will the vehicle have to be IVA tested before registration? Although something is telling me that the engine only carries one point on the IVA. It'd be interesting to know.
Upt'North.

Hi ,
All i need to do is ( as confirm by a DVLA chap , from eagle star house in gosforth) ..

1. change the V55 document from petrol to electric. ( this then makes it Road tax free )
2. Take the bike for a standard MOT , and she is then fit for purpose.
3. Getting insurance for 2002 electric Pan euro.

it will be all ticker tee boo..

regards

Tony