Goldwing replaces the ST1300??

Who want's a bike with a built-in speed limiter?
I am going to guess that the speed limiter is there because of tire speed restrictions. 112 MPH is not a round number in MPH, but it does happen to convert to 180 km/h, which is a round number.

If it's not tire speed that caused the limit, I will guess that Honda put the limit there for some other "very good reason" - possibly because the front end starts to get too light at higher (air)speeds than 112 MPH. I don't think it is normal practice for Honda to limit motorcycle speeds, other than to apply the 300 km/h (186 MPH) "gentleman's agreement" speed limit that all the moto manufacturers have put in place, this for the purpose of preventing various governments from stepping up to the plate and imposing legislative speed limits on superbikes.

Michael
 
I owned a ‘06 ST1300 and a ‘08 Goldwing at the same time. They were completely different rides. When the 2018 Wings came out, I knew I wanted one. At my age, I decided this might be the last bike that I purchase, so I went for it. I sold the ST and the Wing and bought the 2018 Red DCT. Not once have I regretted it. To me, it feels lighter than the ST, with the center of gravity being so much lower. The acceleration and quick shifting of the DCT, doesn’t resemble the older Wing, but the long distance comfort is still there. To me, it’s the best of both bikes, rolled up into one. Supposedly, the 1/4 mile time is 12.8 seconds, hitting the 112 speed limiter before the end of the track. So, it’s not your grandfather’s Goldwing.

Ride Safe
John
Grandfather's GL1800 Goldwing did the 1/4 in 12.78 at 103 in a period test review.

I got to put about 1000 miles on a 2018 DCT Tour and I had a wonderful time of it and I posted here my thoughts on it at the time. While it is lighter and less bulky than the older one I felt that the new one is a little less nimble in the corners, it just doesn't have the same light neutral handling as the older one, the eagerness to roll into a corner that belies its mass. During one of the weekends I had the extended demo, three of us rode the 2018, my 2006 Goldwing , and a 2004 ST1300 at the same time and swapped all the bikes back and forth during the day. The other guys felt the same way about the cornering pressures and the rear suspension differences. I posted about it at the time.
 
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If it's not tire speed that caused the limit, I will guess that Honda put the limit there for some other "very good reason" - possibly because the front end starts to get too light at higher (air)speeds than 112 MPH. I don't think it is normal practice for Honda to limit motorcycle speeds, other than to apply the 300 km/h (186 MPH) "gentleman's agreement" speed limit that all the moto manufacturers have put in place, this for the purpose of preventing various governments from stepping up to the plate and imposing legislative speed limits on superbikes.
I've had my ST1100 faster than 112, so I know that's not artificially limited.
 
While it is lighter and less bulky than the older one I felt that the new one is a little less nimble in the corners, it just doesn't have the same light neutral handling as the older one, the eagerness to roll into a corner. During one of the weekends I had the extended demo, three of us rode the 2018, my 2006, and a 2004 ST1300 at the same time and swapped all the bikes back and forth during the day. The other guys felt the same way about the cornering pressures.
I felt the exact same way about my '01 ST1100 when I first got it, especially in comparison to my '96 NH750ST. It responded to counter-steering at first, but as I got up to speed, it seemed to resist leaning more as I increased steering effort; it just "refused" to lean more as I applied more torque to the handlebars.

With a mountain day-trip coming up, I decided to perform a long-overdue rear suspension adjustment, necessitated by my weight as compared to the previous owner. I adjusted the rear spring locking rings about 1/2" up, to raise the rear end in compensation for the weight difference between him and myself.

The resulting improvement in handling was and is nothing short of remarkable. The ST now leans and returns with a very neutral and predictable feel, easily equal to the NH. The response to steering effort is instant and controllable, allowing me to ride and steer instinctively. Well worth the 15 minutes it took.

So, before dismissing the handling difference as the nature of the beast, it may well respond the same way as a result of making a simple suspension adjustment. Raising the rear makes the forks more vertical, which quickens the steering, and makes it more responsive to steering input. Give it a try next opportunity.
 
......So, before dismissing the handling difference as the nature of the beast, it may well respond the same way as a result of making a simple suspension adjustment. Raising the rear makes the forks more vertical, which quickens the steering, and makes it more responsive to steering input. Give it a try next opportunity.
The new one has electronically adjustable suspension and it’s no longer possible to make sag adjustment to just one end though as you mention a simple adjustment to rear sag might make all the difference. The thing we noticed was a little too much compression damping in the rear shock even on Solo Rider No Cargo.
 
Figured I should chime in.

I rode over 150,000 miles in 11 years on my 06 ST1300. Loved every mile. Rode all the twisty roads from Toronto to Atlanta and the sorrounding area. I purchased the White GW DCT Tour an rode over 19,000 miles from March to October in 2018 on the same roads. This bike for me was amazing, even on the stock seat I road 900 miles in one day with no issues. Also, I like to ride aggressive, which is why I’ve upgraded the front and rear suspension to the Traxxion Dynamics system. In my opinion it handles better that the ST1300. Is it a perfect bike, no is there such a bike.

I called mine, the Angel ST1800
 
Unfortunately, the GW hasnt gone the PA version, so unless a ST1300PA replacement comes out, itll be German engineering in my future. Sat on a 2018 BMW yesterday, pretty nice except i have to lift the leg even higher over the radio shack. But the lumbar support it provides is worth it.

Who knows, maybe it will be EV bikes by then.

Edit. GW PA

236552M

236553
 
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Who want's a bike with a built-in speed limiter??? o_O

For the record, all bikes except MV Agusta have a built in speed limiter (they refused to sign the mfg's agreement), even the Supercharged Kawasaki, although not all are as low as 112. Two out of my last 3 bikes have had 112 mph limiters, but none have even seen 100 mph with me in the seat., so I don't mind it at all. 90 mph is plenty fast enough for me these days.

I test rode the new Wing last February. Although some call it an ST 1800, I found it still too much wing and not enough ST. Bought an FJR instead.
 
For the record, all bikes except MV Agusta have a built in speed limiter (they refused to sign the mfg's agreement), even the Supercharged Kawasaki, although not all are as low as 112. Two out of my last 3 bikes have had 112 mph limiters, but none have even seen 100 mph with me in the seat., so I don't mind it at all. 90 mph is plenty fast enough for me these days.

I test rode the new Wing last February. Although some call it an ST 1800, I found it still too much wing and not enough ST. Bought an FJR instead.
Interesting. Would you happen to know what the speed limiter is set on the FJR?
 
I posted this on another site:

I have both a 2009 ST1300 and 2018 GL. They are in different locations. Each bike is unique unto itself. The 2018 GL is an awesome machine in so many respects, but the ST1300, to me, seems more like motorcycling in a pure form. Yeah, I have a CB, GPS with mp3, RDL seat and some other comforts on the ST, but it's a bike that seems to give me huge smiles when I ride it. It might be because I don't get to ride it a lot (it resides at my vacation home), as it only has 15000 miles on it in almost 9 years of ownership. If I had both bikes in the same location, I do think I'd sell the ST, but for my circumstances it works just fine. Just sayin'.
 
For the record, all bikes except MV Agusta have a built in speed limiter (they refused to sign the mfg's agreement), even the Supercharged Kawasaki, although not all are as low as 112.
You're saying that my '01 ST1100 with a mechanical speedometer will stop accelerating at a set speed, regardless of what gear it's in? How do it know ???o_O
 
I sat on one...better ergonomics...for me a GW has to many gadgets...I wish they made a GW basic...I don't want all the fancy pants crap.
 
You're saying that my '01 ST1100 with a mechanical speedometer will stop accelerating at a set speed, regardless of what gear it's in? How do it know ???o_O
I think he means a rev limiter. The ST's have a rev limiter on them so it will be limited by that. I have seen 130 MPH on mine verified by the speedometer not gps indicated.
 
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I think he means a rev limiter. The ST's have a rev limiter on them so it will be limited by that. I have seen 130 MPH on mine verified by the speedometer not gps indicated.
Bikes like the STs can't pull revs to the rev limiter in top gear. The ST1300 won’t bump the rev limiter in 5th, it’s top speed of 142-145 mph at approximately 8700 rpm is limited by power and aerodynamic drag. IIRC it’s pulling around 9250 rpm when it hits the limiter.

I think what Ferret posted was the gentleman’s agreement among Japanese makers years ago to limit bikes to 300 kph 186 mph. Lesser bikes are sometimes speed limited at lower speeds because of liability concerns. Not all bikes are limited I’m not sure what he meant by that.[/QUOTE]
 
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When I learned that the ST1300 would no longer be made, it occurred to me that one big reason could be that there any "improvements" that Honda could make (such as cruise control) would just bring the ST closer to GoldWing territory and wind up hurting sales of their flagship. And I assume that the GoldWing is also more profitable for them.

Enter the 2018 GoldWing which, IMO, has moved towards the ST's territory. I'm even more certain now that Honda doesn't have room for both.

So, is the GoldWing a replacement? Well, sort of.
 
I had an ST1300 for 14 years. A friend of mine once asked me if I was ever going to buy another bike, I told him maybe, when another bike comes out that is better. Last year I had just shy of 130K on the ST and in Oct. 17' Honda did the unveiling of the new GW. Then in Feb they brought over 50 of them to Austin, TX and MC Journalists from around the world showed up, rode and started reviews in journals and video. I pretty much read and watched every one of them to get others perspectives of this new MC. At this point I decided I was going to buy this new GW, but which one?

In March 18' I spoke to my dealer and said I was interested in one but not sure if it were going to be the Manual or DCT trans. He said he would have both in stock within a week or so. I pretty much new what the manual trans would be about do I asked him if I could ride the DCT when it arrived, he said no problem and he would contact me when it arrived. A few days later he called me and said he could have a DCT Tour prepped the next morning for a test ride about 10 AM. Needless to say I was there. I have known these people for some time and they allowed me 1.5 test time on the bike. The first place I went to was a Target parking lot about 4 blocks from the dealer. In that 4 block ride it was clearly the smoothest, nicest feeling MC I had ever ridden. On arriving to the parking lot my handling concerns were alleviated in 5 minutes. I was able to do figure 8's wheel locked, no problem. Performed other slow speed maneuvers, again with no issues. The extra weight made no difference to me, actually to the contrary, this bike low center of gravity and the double wishbone front end make this easier to handle than the ST. I had about an 8 mile ride in city traffic to the Xpress-way and in those 10 minutes or so I had gotten very comfortable on the bike. It stopped very well (not quite ST) but close. It accelerated very well in Tour mode that I had it in. I went through Econo which is a softer acceleration of Tour mode and Rain mode is softer than Econo mode. I then went for it and put it in Sport mode. Well you better be hanging onto the handlebars in this mode (not quite ST fast but the ST 1/4 mile is 11.4 sec and as noted above in 0-60 times 12.8 sec, but that is wrong and can be laid to rest being one GW owner took his GW manual to the dragstrip and ran a 11.9 sec 1/4 mile.) So there is a difference in speed but on this big of bike you will hardly notice it. The torque this bike produces is simply incredible. See attached Dyno graph. There is no torque curve with this bike, at under 1000 RPM's this bike has over 100 FP of torque, at 1200 RPM's it peaks at 108 FP of torque. I have never seen another motorcycle do this. It carries this torque from again 1200 RPM's at 108 FP to 4500 RPM's at 104 FP of torque. But in the same breath Honda also builds F1 cars.

I arrived on the Xpress-way and took it up to 60 and was impressed with the handling, wind manageability (there were 15 to 20 MPH crosswinds) and smoothness. I took her to 70 and all the way up to rev limiter. It was steady the entire way. I was sold at this point, but the DCT was not for me. I elected to purchase a red manual Tour model.

A few after thoughts on this bike. The bike isn't perfect, but very close. Others might argue that, but then you can't make them all happy. The GPS isn't useless but has issues, to give Honda they have released 2 software upgrades that have dramatically improved it. Apple Carplay works but the promised Android in non-existent. The latter from what I understand is on the Google maps part. The speedo is the most accurate I have seen. My bike is understated by 1 mph at speeds above 65. The headlights are amazing, ten LED's all the time and more with high beams. I would have bought this bike for the cruise control and self cancelling turn signals, the latter some complain that they cancel to quickly. In a straight run they will blink about 9 or 10 times then cancel if a turn is not involved. This is good in my opinion on a slight x-way ramp exit where there is no turn, if there is they cancel if not re-engage. The stock seat is the most comfortable that I have ever ridden, just not a fan of vinyl (sweats me). Some say it is uncomfortable, again opinion, but then I ride a road bicycle about a hundred miles a week when weather allows in Michigan. So most seats are comfortable for me ( the stock ST seat was replaced in my 2nd year). Laam MC seats has mine right now to do his stuff in leather. Brake lights are awesome. Gas mileage is incredible for a bike this size and all on 86 octane and no, don't put premium in it. My trip B odometer is above a 50 mpg for the bikes life, that has to do with me being in 6th gear in the high 90 percentile by 40 mph, your riding may differ. Wind coverage is great, I had the opportunity to test it multiple times now. One time was back in April 2018 coming home from Florida. That is when the Alberta clipper came through and my ride through the Smokies and Ohio were in rain, sleet and snow with Ohio adding a 40 mph plus crosswind and I rode right through it. This bike does very well in crosswinds. Well there are too many other things I could say but that wouldn't give you the opportunity to explore other features and abilities this bike offers. Oh yeah one more thing, this bike is very ST like and is an easy transition.
 

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When I retire (760 days from today, not that I am counting or anything) I'll be considering swapping my ST1300 for a 2019 or 2020 model Goldwing Tour that someone else bought and failed to bond with, or that somehow got left on the dealer's floor (though I doubt there will be many of those). Until then, though, it doesn't replace my ST.
 
Bikes like the STs can't pull revs to the rev limiter in top gear. The ST1300 won’t bump the rev limiter in 5th, it’s top speed of 142-145 mph at approximately 8700 rpm is limited by power and aerodynamic drag. IIRC it’s pulling around 9250 rpm when it hits the limiter.

I think what Ferret posted was the gentleman’s agreement among Japanese makers years ago to limit bikes to 300 kph 186 mph. Lesser bikes are sometimes speed limited at lower speeds because of liability concerns. Not all bikes are limited I’m not sure what he meant by that.
[/QUOTE]


Three things limit the top speed on a bike. They can be limited by gearing,or power/drag, or electronics either by rev limiting or speed limiting. In the "old days" it was the gearing or power/drag that limited top speed. Since 2000 and the mfg agreement that dduelin referred to it has been by electronics. Many are electronically rev limited in lower gears and speed limited in the taller gears. For bikes like the FJ-09 it's electronically limited to 134 mph. For the CB 1100 and Gold Wing it's 112 mph. For the turbo charged Kawasaki it's 186 mph. The ST is limited by power/drag. All bikes are speed limited one way or another. In Japan, all new bikes designated to sell in the home market, regardless of displacement or hp are limited to the National Speed limit of 180 Kmph or 112 mph.

Rollie Free's Vincent only had 65 horsepower but went 150 mph thanks to altered gearing and reduction in drag (Rollie laying on the seat wearing a bathing suit, cap and slippers ). Electronics were pretty basic back then.lol
 
Thank you for your real world experience on the new Gold Wing.
It seems to be quite an improvement.
 
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